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Talk:Germain's Character Sheet

2011-08-24T14:36:27Z

146.127.253.44:

Re: Ring of E-Mail
*Did you throw this away or is it just stashed? -gm
** Just stashed--no intention to throw it away, although I might tell people I did. --[[User:Msallen|Msallen]]
*Also, Ed mentioned plans to fake his death, FWiW.... -gm
** If he succeeds, I'll put it on again --[[User:Msallen|Msallen]]
*Also, Also, you might not want to discard it until after Boss Fight. It's not fucking around. "Very Dangerous." I don't suggest finding and reading that definition in the ECL guide. -gm
** Done! --[[User:Msallen|Msallen]]

Yeah, between his professional build, and the Dragonman and Bard pick up, Germain needs to pick up a few Knowledge (Law) skills so he can become Wydmoor's preeminent lawyer. It's the gateway to politics, and it always has been! But, yeah, Oratory is a legitimate skill - instead of singing or playing an instrument to inspire courage, you go all Saint Crispin's Day. I actually think it works amazingly well with the class and the slightly more martial tone of it in this campaign. -gm
:Actually, I've thought about that before, and the only reason I didn't take it is that as per the rules, knowledge (local) includes laws and such for the region. That said, I'm all for another skill if you want to separate them, although I think we might should consider that a knowledge (law) would get synch bonuses from knowledge (local) and knowledge (religion), and possibly more. Alternatively, a profession skill might be appropriate for encompassing what you are explaining. --[[User:Msallen|Msallen]]
::Nah, I'm down with Law. It might take some sort of examination and certification process. Probably a roll. -gm
:::Which, profession or knowledge? Its not clear at all --[[User:Msallen|Msallen]]
::::If we go with the Tome profession tweak, making 1 rank in Profession(Law) perhaps a "Law Student", and 2 ranks a "Lawyer" would probably be more than adequate, and could have the effect of allowing knowledge skills to be used for law-related questions (perhaps with a bonus at "Lawyer"), in lieu of being able to simply plop down some rolls and make money as a lawyer. I don't think Law will have enough use to justify spending points in as a sub-category of knowledge. -[[User:Slitherrr|Slitherrr]]

I'd like to flesh out the concept of Bog Iron a bit for the Wydmoor region. I was sort of enamoured with it when I was doing my [[Wydmoor Swamp]] research because, with its natural rust-resistence, it is almost as if it has magical properties even in the real world. One idea is just to make it equivalent to cold iron, which is the reason I bring it up here. Can we retcon that sword from the orc battle to be a Wydmoor-made, bog iron weapon? --[[User:Msallen|Msallen]]
:A funny note, brought up by the Tome, is that D&D cold iron is silly--the reason cold iron is good against fey is because, at the time these things were made up, cold iron represented the high technology of the time. Since "regular" steel, the material of "regular" weapons, takes more technological prowess than cold iron, it doesn't make sense that cold iron is super-effective against fey and regular iron isn't. Anyway, that doesn't change anything in the Mainland, it was just a hilarious observation. -[[User:Slitherrr|Slitherrr]]
:: Yeah, cold iron is pretty funny when you read the history of the term. --[[User:Msallen|Msallen]]
::: FWiW, the primary use is of iron IMO is not in taking out fey, but in taking out demons and devils. Also, sure, I'm ok with making Bog Iron count as Cold Iron, and having the sword be Bog Iron for flavor. -gm
:::: The fey thing is really primarily a historical folklore reference from the real world. From wikipedia: ''"Cold iron" is sometimes asserted to repel, contain, or harm ghosts, fairies, witches, and/or other malevolent supernatural creatures.'' I didn't realize it was useful against Demons too until I checked out the monster records--the cold iron section in special materials only mentions fey. Also, it looks like cold iron is only in the DR of Demons, but Devils don't have any special vulnerabilities to cold iron. --[[User:Msallen|Msallen]]
::::: *blink* Who are you talking to like I don't know that? I just meant players fight waaaaaay more demons than fey. -gm

===Skills===
Do synergy bonuses stack? I was under the impression that they didn't. -[[User:Slitherrr|Slitherrr]] 12:09, 11 November 2009 (EST)

A little research suggests they don't as of 3.5. Booo. -[[User:Slitherrr|Slitherrr]] 12:10, 11 November 2009 (EST)

Actually, scratch that. It looks like it went from being a "synergy bonus" to an "unnamed bonus", so despite the vague wording of the synergy bit in the skill, it evidently does, indeed, stack. -[[User:Slitherrr|Slitherrr]] 12:13, 11 November 2009 (EST)

I am pretty sure they stack based only on the few character optimization posts I've read. Those nerds would have seen a rules violation from a mile away. That said, I think they shouldn't. Syn bonuses are definitely unbalanced and heavily abusable in 3.5, especially around diplomacy. I wouldn't abuse them like I have except that I self-identify as a munchkin and I feel no obligation to violate my lifestyle. -[[User:Msallen|Msallen]] 13:03, 11 November 2009 (EST)

: Diplomacy is impossible to unbalance because you can't talk your way out of a knife to the back. -gm

:: Only true if you completely disregard the "influence NPC reactions" table (which any good game master will do anyways). A real diplomancer would have at least +22 or so at my level, which would allow me to avoid all kinds of combat through talkin'. Also: [http://community.wizards.com/go/thread/view/75882/19861846/Campaign_Smashers_II_The_stuff_that_completely_breaks_the_game]. -[[User:Msallen|Msallen]] 14:03, 12 November 2009 (EST)

::: I *wish* I had that diplomancer in my group. He'd be dead in two sessions. I do not miss players like this, though I'm somewhat eager to encounter one again one day. Good luck out rules lawyering me in 3.5 : the Diplomancer concept has a fatal flaw that the player seems to willfully ignore. Namely : "Changing others’ attitudes with Diplomacy generally takes at least 1 full minute (10 consecutive full-round actions). In some situations, this time requirement may greatly increase." I suppose the counter would be to take a rushed one at -10, which I would patently disallow, because you can't do any meaningful diplomacy in six seconds. Since that would lead to some whinging and arguing, I'd give the "ok" and then move on to my next trick. After all, that's hardly the only fuckin' I could give. ". . . to influence the attitude of a nonplayer character, or wild empathy checks made to influence the attitude of an animal or magical beast."

Notice that article? It's consistantly singular. That is, even with a hurried diplomacy action every round, you'd still only get to turn ONE NPCs reaction per round, not that of a whole group. And, the instant Mr Diplomancer convinces that one guy to oppose his fellows, I'll give you one guess as to who the rest of the opposition will concentrate fire on. -gm

:Yeah, and what Jones is saying is basically what is flavoring the Professional discussion from my point of view, and what makes him so tough to balance. His power outside of combat stems a lot from talky-talky, and that power is so easy to cancel out that it's really hard to judge exactly how powerful it makes him. -[[User:Slitherrr|Slitherrr]]

Whats crappy about the sync bonuses is how quickly they push other characters out of the dipl game. In general, a player that wants to be top-notch at a specific skill for player reasons can be with minimal investment. However, if you don't go ape-shit with diplomacy getting all the support skills, its really hard to have much impact compared to a diplomancer type. --[[User:Msallen|Msallen]] 13:16, 14 January 2010 (EST)

You know, Germain really doesn't spend much time lying anymore--now that hes increasingly important, he just doesn't have to front as much. I'm considering focusing on Dipl, SM, and GI, and putting bluff/intimidate on the back burner. At +10, they are pretty strong, and I'm sure I'll be able to buy them up a little more (and benefit from the Dragoman feature). I might just leave him at "capable" liar and buy up some more knowledge skills. --[[User:Msallen|Msallen]]

Did you know in ancient times, big pilgrim cities would often be flush with "travelers guides" of various degrees of quality? You could have picked a few up, at nominal gold cost, to justify enough for a couple points in dadtim and/or alexandria's city. -gm
: Yeah, I was considering it. Points are tight trying to qualify for Dragoman at 7 and bring my wheelhouse skills up to max. I already dropped bluff from my wheelhouse to be able to get some extra points in knowledge skills :| I'll see what I can do. --[[User:Msallen|Msallen]]
:: My usual playbook fort that situation is to sacrifice my max skill to get the glass I'm looking for, then double down the next level to get back up to max.
::: I did that last level :| I doubled down on SM to bring it to max since I want it to be my main bag, and then I only put a point in my other max skills. I do think another knowledge: local is a good idea. --[[User:Msallen|Msallen]]

Skill-wise, my next step with Germain is to start working his knowledge skills up to 5 ranks. At that point, they grant their synergy bonuses and give me +9 on my rolls. Since this is a guaranteed aid-another success, its sort of a cool feature. It'll mean Germ can get some rarer info (20 avg), and can always contribute to the work of a real expert. --[[User:Msallen|Msallen]]
:Only 16 ranks to go! -[[User:Slitherrr|Slitherrr]]

Another level, another drama. Dragoman lets me pick up Skill Mastery (+2 and take-10 under stress) on Sense Motive, which I would like to be one of Germ's major strengths as an investigator/statesman. However, Bard is just a shitload more utility. It's probably going to have to be bard :| --[[User:Msallen|Msallen]]
: Well, as long as the party stays x+1 on you, at least there's the bonus XP. -gm
: I don't really picture Germain plucking a lute. -[[User:Slitherrr|Slitherrr]]
:: Perform (Oration). I'm not sure what sort of details I need to work out on this with Jones, but we've been talking about public speech as a bard focus for Germain. The ability to give a powerful speech makes sense for a lot of bard abilities (although maybe countersong is a little hinky) --[[User:Msallen|Msallen]]
::: Yeah, between his professional build, and the Dragonman and Bard pick up, Germain needs to pick up a few Knowledge (Law) skills so he can become Wydmoor's preeminent lawyer. It's the gateway to politics, and it always has been! But, yeah, Oratory is a legitimate skill - instead of singing or playing an instrument to inspire courage, you go all Saint Crispin's Day. I actually think it works amazingly well with the class and the slightly more martial tone of it in this campaign. -gm
:::: Actually, I've thought about that before, and the only reason I didn't take it is that as per the rules, knowledge (local) includes laws and such for the region. That said, I'm all for another skill if you want to separate them, although I think we might should consider that a knowledge (law) would get synch bonuses from knowledge (local) and knowledge (religion), and possibly more. Alternatively, a profession skill might be appropriate for encompassing what you are explaining. --[[User:Msallen|Msallen]]
::::: Nah, I'm down with Law. It might take some sort of examination and certification process. Probably a roll. -gm
:::::: Which, profession or knowledge? Its not clear at all --[[User:Msallen|Msallen]]
::::::: If we go with the Tome profession tweak, making 1 rank in Profession(Law) perhaps a "Law Student", and 2 ranks a "Lawyer" would probably be more than adequate, and could have the effect of allowing knowledge skills to be used for law-related questions (perhaps with a bonus at "Lawyer"), in lieu of being able to simply plop down some rolls and make money as a lawyer. I don't think Law will have enough use to justify spending points in as a sub-category of knowledge. -[[User:Slitherrr|Slitherrr]]

===Leveling and Respec===
Ranger! Crazy talk! -[[User:Slitherrr|Slitherrr]]
: FAVORED ENEMY: HUMAN! --[[User:192.147.58.6|192.147.58.6]] 13:11, 14 January 2010 (EST)
Potential changes from Fighter -> Professional respec:
* HP -2
* Fort Save -1
* Remove: Evasion
* Add: Insightful Defense
* Skills: 6 pts (can't raise any skills past level 3 max)
** 1 listen
** 1 spot
** 2 search
** 2 intimidate

No changes occur to:
* Feats: lost fighter bonus, gained prof bonus--since I took skill feats with 2 human starting feats and
* BaB: Prof level 2->3 gets a +1 BaB

Done! In the process I realized I took 8 skills instead of 9 for my newest ranger level! --[[User:Msallen|Msallen]]

I guess there is a part of me that is looking at the [[Field Marshall]] and seriously considering it. --[[User:Msallen|Msallen]]
: Then go capture one. Kib has a reason to be able to access Sentinal and Field Marshall classes. I'm not sure Germain does. -gm

The 1-level splashes in all these classes with strong saves have really rocketed them to crazy levels. You're at 26 total without the ring, and without spending any feats on saves, and without even having great Con or Dex! I pity the fool who tries to ''mind control'' your ass. -[[User:Slitherrr|Slitherrr]]
: No shit, although the only time anyone tried to mind control me they succeeded. Once I get my sense motive up to ridiculous levels, I'll be moving on to saves with Will as the top priority, though, so I'll be smooth sailing again! --[[User:Msallen|Msallen]]
: Silly boy, why would anyone mind control the least effective member of the party? No, you kill the talker first because he brings you no upside, and then mind control the guy with the monster scythe. Maybe reverse the order of those two, in a perfect world. -gm
:: Talker has proven pretty hard to kill--Germain can't fight, but hes routinely high AC with good HP and saves. But yeah, too bad there are no scribable or wandable bard spells. --[[User:Msallen|Msallen]]
:: http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/breakEnchantment.htm
::: In general, the goal with Germain taking Bard was to expand his abilities as a utility knife in combat. With the right wands and scrolls he can become an off-healer, a spellbreaker, crowd control, and other utility effects. He can survive in battle without too much help, and its not like his actions are better spent on attacks. --[[User:Msallen|Msallen]]
:::: I think the ideal for Kib would be for him to find a cudgel with a "Break Enchantment" effect. Also, hilarious. One great thing about the petomancer, though, is that while they might not singly be amazing in combat, they're pretty good put together, AND that's twice as many people to have to ''mind control''!

Don't forget, if you start cranking Bard levels, that you're going to also have to keep your Ranger levels up to not get XP penalties. -[[User:Slitherrr|Slitherrr]]
: Yeah, I looked into that. I don't think I will go past bard 2 anyways, maybe not even that far. There isn't a lot of incentive to do more than splash bard if you aren't going all bard. The only reason to go to 2 is level 1 spells. --[[User:Msallen|Msallen]]

===Gear===
An unintended consequence of our changes is that my goofy earring, which gives skill bonuses or eagle's splendor, gets a little cooler at mid levels --[[User:Msallen|Msallen]]
: Hm?
: Also, what'd you think of that new feat?
:: Er. Because the clicky will give me an AC bonus starting at level 6. I like the feat in concept, although I'm not sure I'm capable of evaluating how useful it is. It might be too situational, but I don't have a good grip on that sort of thing. --[[User:Msallen|Msallen]]
::: Well, I didn't actually create the feat, I lifted it. I imagine the goal is to give an Aid Another to someone ELSE who is also going to AoO? Also, don't forget, your Eagle's Splendor only lasts 3 minutes and shuts off your +1 for 24 hours. ;)
:::: Um. Eagle's Splendor is Charisma, not Intelligence. It'll be a + to Will Saves if you take the feat, but that's it.-[[User:Slitherrr|Slitherrr]]
::::: Yeah, sorry, I assume what was meant was Fox's Cunning. LE's Charisma Cloak clickies to Eagle's Splendor. -gm
::::: Ah, I think Jones meant for it to be Fox's Cunning (int bonus) based on how he explained it: get +1 on int skills all the time, or get +2 for a short period. That said, if I was wrong, sweet! I'll take a charisma buff any day! --[[User:Msallen|Msallen]]

Does the arrow-magnet quality of germ's buckler still work if he is wielding it with a 2-handed weapon like a bow? Ie. if I am denied the shield's AC bonus, am I also denied the ability? --[[User:Msallen|Msallen]]
: Excellent question. No. If it is stowed in your backpack, it does not magnet. You actually CAN use a buckler with a two handed weapon, though. -gm
:: I guess this could go 2 ways, but I'm happy with this way since it serves my purpose (like germain gives a shit about another -1 to hit). On first reading of the buckler rules, it looked to me like you lost the AC bonus because you are using your off hand to wield the 2-handed weapon. --[[User:Msallen|Msallen]]
:: ''This small metal shield is worn strapped to your forearm. You can use a bow or crossbow without penalty while carrying it. You can also use your shield arm to wield a weapon (whether you are using an off-hand weapon or using your off hand to help wield a two-handed weapon), but you take a -1 penalty on attack rolls while doing so. This penalty stacks with those that may apply for fighting with your off hand and for fighting with two weapons. In any case, if you use a weapon in your off hand, you don’t get the buckler’s AC bonus for the rest of the round. ''
::: Oh shit, we are both total retards. --[[User:Msallen|Msallen]]
::: '''You can use a bow or crossbow without penalty while carrying it.'''

===Leadership===

Leadership at Professional 5? You get it for free in one more level! -[[User:66.207.91.56|66.207.91.56]]
: Yeah, I know its kind of stupid. Might still change my mind, but here was my reasoning:
: * It will be a while before I take Prof 6 since there are some skill boosters from Dragoman that I am more interested in
: * I'm most interested in leading an organization, so ''Improved Leadership'' is actually pretty cool since it boosts my henchmen
: * I like the RP element of stacking feats around socials skills and leadership, even if it isn't optimal.

I still don't get why you'd grab leadership at lvl 5. Cohort always maxes out at Level-2. I always thought the +2 Improved Leadership was kind of a booby prize. -gm
: Yeah, I don't know if I will take it in the end. It depends on a lot of things:
:* Have I had an in-game justification to get a second knowledge (local) skill up to 6. If I can, I'll be picking up [[Dragoman]] at level 7. I'll probably take it to level 2--the +3 bonus to all charisma skills is hot for me, and I'd really like to get +2 and take-10 with Sense Motive. That'll mean I won't get leadership until level 9 if I don't take it as a feat.
:* Do I have an in-game justification to take leadership at 6? I might not even feel like the Germ has the contacts or resources to take leadership, and I'd like to have an NPC in mind for cohort potential. In all honesty, I'm probably also more interested in the followers than the cohorts, since I'm not even sure I'll take a combat-based cohort. For followers, the +2 bonus does have a noticeable effect.
:* What do you have in mind for the leadership feat? Its a weird feat with very little structure that is highly dependent on the GM, campaign, and player. So I'll just be talking to you a lot about it as I get closer to 6. If it it has a strong RP component that'll cause NPC organizations to put me in charge of lots of people, then I'll take it earlier. If I have to have my own base of operations, funding, and political capital to make full use of it, then I'll take it later. If it means I'm more likely to start building more permanent relationships with a higher level of loyalty with the NPCs I interact with, I'll take it earlier. Etc. etc.
:Hence the question mark. Its still pretty unresolved whether and how I'm going to use the feat. --[[User:Msallen|Msallen]]
:: Well, you've got, what, 2 more levels before it's an issue? I'll backburner it for now - 2010/1401 is going to be a VERY chaotic year for Wydmoor, so where Germ goes and how he develops is up in the air: all possibilities are on the table. That's all I can say about that right now. If you wanted a knowledge local, you could, perhaps, pick a city or region where one of the OTHER characters has some Knowledge Local skill points and learn from them. I mean, I'm a big fan of assuming the players are doing stuff like conversating and such during all the Walking Time characters do, so I've never bought fully into the "well, I didn't do anything in game to justify the expense." With months of skipped over downtime, there's plenty of time to practice skills and wotnot on the road. (Though, for something like your ranger level, the RP component becomes a lot more important.) -gm
::: Aight. I guess I was under the impression that you had to spend some time in an area to build up knowledge (local), but chatting, libraries, and reading newspapers is enough? I'll probably aim to build up my knowledge of ubrekt city, since I already have some points in it and its probably easy to get news/info about since its such an important city. Or I'll see what the other party members have. Still doesn't really resolve this issue since it'll just cause my to postpone prof 6 for 3 levels for sure. --[[User:Msallen|Msallen]]
===Languages===
Looks like I am short a language, since ubrekti and regional language are both granted to starting characters. What makes sense from a game perspective. Germ has been around Fresia/Flannery and Ubrekti City most of his life, so it seems like I could easily make a case for any of them? --[[User:Msallen|Msallen]]
: I thought you already had Flannary and Fresia? The regional language for Ubrekt is actually Hakni. -gm
:: Wouldn't I start with Ubrekti and Fresia? I was under the impression from the contentious language talk page that you start with common + regional + int bonus? --[[User:Msallen|Msallen]]
::: Well, either Ubrekti and Fresia, or Ubrekti and Flanneri. What I think that Matt is referring to, though, is that if you spent a lot of time in Ubrekti City, it'd make sense if you knew Hakni, since that's the actual regional language, there. -[[User:Slitherrr|Slitherrr]]
::: Also, for being the more worldly and less beefy incarnation of Kib, you sure haven't spent many points in Speak Language. -[[User:Slitherrr|Slitherrr]]
:::: The only other language we've had to deal with was Lizardmanlander! When will I ever use that again? Probably pick up Odessan soon since you people are invading my new town. --[[User:Msallen|Msallen]]
::::: Yeah, I have no idea why Odessan is so widely spoken in the MFC group, since most of them are Gildenhomers. WEIRD. -[[User:Slitherrr|Slitherrr]]
:::::: Is it really that widely spoken? I see Thed being the only one having it that doesn't have a super obvious reason to... -[[User:Feantari|Feantari]]
::::::: You're right, for some reason I was remembering Thoven as having it. -[[User:Slitherrr|Slitherrr]]

===Edrell-Mail===
: (Rcvd at some point during the combats of last game you were too much of a girl to witness, both in and out of game.)
:: CITY BESIEGED. YOUR RETURN UNLIKELY FOR AWHILE. NEWS IS OUT ABOUT MAYOR. WAR ROOM IN CHAOS. HAVE MAYOR'S RING? URGENT. (Rc'vd 1 Pd/Rnwl)
::: Woo! Also, what's that about line-breaks in your edit summary? -slith

Germain's Character Sheet

2011-08-24T14:34:40Z

146.127.253.44:

Player: [[User:Msallen|MSAllen]] 
Name: [[Germain]] 
Classes/Levels: [[Professional]] 6, [[Dragoman]] 2, Bard 1, Ranger 1 
Race: [[Human]] 
Alignment: N 
Origin: [[Fresia]]/[[Flannary]] 
Residence: [[Wydmoor Free City]] 

Achievements:
* Elementary, My Dear Watson (40xp)
* Renowned
* Prison Break (25xp)
* Plans within Plans (2500xp, +1 local, wydmoor)

==Attributes==

===Primary===
{|
|Strength||  ||10 (+0)
|-
|Dexterity||  ||12 (+1)
|-
|Constitution||  ||12 (+1)
|-
|Intelligence||  ||14 (+2)
|-
|Wisdom||  ||14 (+2)
|-
|Charisma||  ||16 (+3) [4th and 8th level attribute bonus]
|}

===Secondary===
{|
|Hit Points||  ||76||  ||9 + 9 + 8 + 8 + 8 + 8 + 6 + 6 + 6 + 8
|-
|Armor Class||||19||||+5 leather armor +2, +3 dex bonus (+2 to Dex bonus from insightful defense), +2 [[Barbarian King's Buckler|shield]]
|-
|Base Attack Bonus||||+6/+1||||+4 professional 5, +1 ranger 1, +1 dragoman 2
|-
|Initiative||||+1||||
|-
|Base Speed||||30 ft.||||leather
|-
|Fort Save||||+5||||+2 professional 6, +2 ranger 1, +1 stat, <del>+1 [[Germain's_Character_Sheet#Ring_of_Tweets_(Greater)|ring]]</del>
|-
|Reflex Save||||+13||||+5 professional 6, +2 bard 1, +3 dragoman 2, +2 ranger 1, +1 stat, <del>+1 [[Germain's_Character_Sheet#Ring_of_Tweets_(Greater)|ring]]</del>
|-
|Will Save||||+12||||+5 professional 6, +2 bard 1, +3 dragoman 2, +2 stat, <del>+1 [[Germain's_Character_Sheet#Ring_of_Tweets_(Greater)|ring]]</del>
|-
|[[Table:_Leadership|Leadership]] (Cohort)||||16||||+10 level, +3 chr, -1 cohort different alignment, +1 regional renown, +1 fairness and generosity*, +2 improved leadership
|-
|[[Table:_Leadership|Leadership]] (Follower)||||18||||+10 level, +3 chr, -1 moves around, +1 regional renown, +1 fairness and generosity*, +2 base of operations*, +2 improved leadership
|}

*this will continue to cost you gold monthly. We can come up with a gp per follower per level formula when you get some real staff going on, or see if you want to drop the bonus at some point.

==Feats and Abilities==

===Purchased Feats===
*Combat Expertise
*Investigator (+2 search, +2 gather information)
*[[Knowledgeable]] (+1 all knowledge skills)
*Leadership
*Negotiator (+2 diplomacy, +2 sense motive)
*Persuader (+2 bluff, +2 intimidate)
*Skill Focus (Diplomacy, Sense Motive)

===Class Feats===
*Bardic Knowledge +6 (+1 dragoman, +1 bard, +2 stat, +2 syn (knowledge (history)))
*Bardic Oration
*Countersong
*Fascinate
*Favored Enemy: Human
*Insightful Defense +2
*Inspire Courage +1
*Proficiency (Armor): Light, Medium
*Proficiency (Shield): Small, Large
*Proficiency (Weapon): Simple, Martial
*Silver Tongue (Charisma)
*Skill Mastery (Sense Motive)
*Track +6 (+2 survival, +2 stat, +2 syn (search))
*Uncanny Dodge
*Wild Empathy +6 (+1 ranger, +3 stat, +2 syn (handle animal))

===Languages===
*Dwarven
*Flannari
*Fresian (??? regional variant)
*Hakni
*Odessan (training)
*Ubrekti
*[[Ssel'it|Lizardmanlander]]

==Skills==
{|class=sortable
!Skill!!class=unsortable|  !!Bonus!!class=unsortable|  !!class=unsortable|Bonus Derivation
|-
|[http://www.d20srd.org/srd/skills/bluff.htm Bluff]||||15||||7 ranks, +3 stat, +2 persuader, +3 silver tongue
|-
|[http://www.d20srd.org/srd/skills/diplomacy.htm Diplomacy]||||30||||13 ranks, +3 stat, +2 negotiator, +3 skill focus, +6 syn (bluff, sm, nobility), +3 silver tongue
|-
|[http://www.d20srd.org/srd/skills/gatherInformation.htm Gather Information]||||21||||13 ranks, +3 stat, +2 investigator, +3 silver tongue
|-
|[http://www.d20srd.org/srd/skills/handleAnimal.htm Handle Animal]||||11||||5 ranks, +3 stat, +3 silver tongue
|-
|[http://www.d20srd.org/srd/skills/intimidate.htm Intimidate]||||15||||5 ranks, +3 stat, +2 persuader, +2 syn (bluff), +3 silver tongue
|-
|[http://www.d20srd.org/srd/skills/knowledge.htm Knowledge] (Arcana)||||6||||2 ranks, +2 stat, +1 knowledgeable, +1 [[Germain's_Character_Sheet#Absolutely_Fabulous_Earring_of_Competence|earring]]
|-
|[http://www.d20srd.org/srd/skills/knowledge.htm Knowledge] (Geography)||||9||||5 ranks, +2 stat, +1 knowledgeable, +1 [[Germain's_Character_Sheet#Absolutely_Fabulous_Earring_of_Competence|earring]]
|-
|[http://www.d20srd.org/srd/skills/knowledge.htm Knowledge] (History)||||9||||5 ranks, +2 stat, +1 knowledgeable, +1 [[Germain's_Character_Sheet#Absolutely_Fabulous_Earring_of_Competence|earring]]
|-
|[http://www.d20srd.org/srd/skills/knowledge.htm Knowledge] (Local, Alexandria City)||||6||||2 ranks, +2 stat, +1 knowledgeable, +1 [[Germain's_Character_Sheet#Absolutely_Fabulous_Earring_of_Competence|earring]]
|-
|[http://www.d20srd.org/srd/skills/knowledge.htm Knowledge] (Local, Home)||||8||||4 ranks, +2 stat, +1 knowledgeable, +1 [[Germain's_Character_Sheet#Absolutely_Fabulous_Earring_of_Competence|earring]]
|-
|[http://www.d20srd.org/srd/skills/knowledge.htm Knowledge] (Local, Ubrekt City)||||10||||6 ranks, +2 stat, +1 knowledgeable, +1 [[Germain's_Character_Sheet#Absolutely_Fabulous_Earring_of_Competence|earring]]
|-
|[http://www.d20srd.org/srd/skills/knowledge.htm Knowledge] (Local, Wydmoor Free City)||||14||||10 ranks, +2 stat, +1 knowledgeable, +1 [[Germain's_Character_Sheet#Absolutely_Fabulous_Earring_of_Competence|earring]]
|-
|[http://www.d20srd.org/srd/skills/knowledge.htm Knowledge] (Nature)||||9||||5 ranks, +2 stat, +1 knowledgeable, +1 [[Germain's_Character_Sheet#Absolutely_Fabulous_Earring_of_Competence|earring]]
|-
|[http://www.d20srd.org/srd/skills/knowledge.htm Knowledge] (Nobility)||||9||||5 ranks, +2 stat, +1 knowledgeable, +1 [[Germain's_Character_Sheet#Absolutely_Fabulous_Earring_of_Competence|earring]]
|-
|[http://www.d20srd.org/srd/skills/knowledge.htm Knowledge] (Religion)||||6||||2 ranks, +2 stat, +1 knowledgeable, +1 [[Germain's_Character_Sheet#Absolutely_Fabulous_Earring_of_Competence|earring]]
|-
|Languages||||||||1 rank
|-
|[http://www.d20srd.org/srd/skills/listen.htm Listen]||||11||||9 ranks, +2 stat
|-
|[http://www.d20srd.org/srd/skills/perform.htm Perform] (Oration)||||11||||5 ranks, +3 stat, +3 silver tongue
|-
|[http://www.d20srd.org/srd/skills/profession.htm Profession] (Law)||||||||2 rank
|-
|[http://www.d20srd.org/srd/skills/ride.htm Ride]||||6||||3 ranks, +2 syn (ha) +1 stat
|-
|[http://www.d20srd.org/srd/skills/search.htm Search]||||11||||7 ranks, +2 stat, +2 investigator
|-
|[http://www.d20srd.org/srd/skills/senseMotive.htm Sense Motive]||||22||||13 ranks, +2 stat, +2 negotiator, +3 skill focus, +2 skill mastery
|-
|[http://www.d20srd.org/srd/skills/spot.htm Spot]||||11||||9 ranks, +2 stat
|-
|[http://www.d20srd.org/srd/skills/survival.htm Survival]||||6||||2 ranks, +2 stat +2 syn (nature)
|}
* Using TOME profession rules

==Notable Equipment==
===[[Barbarian King's Buckler]]===
* +1 buckler
* when first struck by a missile weapon in a round, you may make a DC 20 save to block the arrow
* any arrows passing within 10' the wielder are rerouted to him

===[[Coldheart Bow]]===
* +1 shortbow
* +1d6 cold damage on hits

===Bog Iron Longsword===
* masterwork cold-iron longsword
* forged from Wydmoor [[Bog Iron]]

===Horn of Haste===
* silver horn
* cast haste 2/day (as a 5th level caster)

===Amulet of Halitosis===
* breath fire 3/day
* 15" cone, 5d4 damage, DC 15 reflex

===Absolutely Fabulous Earring of Competence===
* +1 to intelligence skill checks
* can be activated to cast Fox's Cunning, but skill bonus is lost for 24 hours

===<del>Ring of E-Mail</del>===
* ring of resistance +1 (all saves)
* can be activated to send a 20 word message to [[Edrell Odenthorpe|Edrell]], but protection is lost for 24 hours
* The E stands for Edrell
* Can't be seen wearing this around since Ed's betrayal

===<del>Ring of Tweets</del>===
* once per day, may send a 10 word message to [[Edrell Odenthorpe|Edrell]]
* invisible for 2 rounds, at-will, 2-day
* stolen by that rat [[Fenn]]

==Advancement==
Starting Feats: Persuader, Investigator

===Level 1: [[Professional]] 1===
*Bonus Feat: [[Knowledgeable]]
*4 Bluff
*4 Diplomacy
*4 Gather Info
*4 Knowledge (Local, Wydmoor)
*4 Knowledge (Local, Home)
*2 Knowledge (Local, Ubrekt City)
*2 Knowledge (Nobility)
*2 Knowledge (Religion)
*2 Knowledge (Geography)
*2 Knowledge (History)
*4 Listen
*2 Search
*4 Sense Motive
*4 Spot

===Level 2: [[Professional]] 2===
*1 Bluff
*1 Diplomacy
*1 Gather Info
*2 Intimidate
*1 Listen
*2 Ride
*1 Search
*1 Sense Motive
*1 Spot

===Level 3: [[Professional]] 3===
*Level Feat: Combat Expertise
*Bonus Feat: Negotiator
*1 Bluff
*1 Diplomacy
*1 Gather Info
*1 Intimidate
*1 Knowledge (Local, Wydmoor)
*1 Listen
*1 Ride
*2 Search
*1 Sense Motive
*1 Spot

===Level 4: Ranger 1===
*Level Stat Bonus: Charisma
*Class Feature: Favored enemy: Human
*5 Handle Animal
*2 Knowledge (Nature)
*2 Survival

===Level 5: [[Professional]] 4===
*Class Feature: Uncanny Dodge
*Language: Dwarven
*1 Diplomacy
*1 Gather Info
*1 Intimidate
*2 Knowledge (Local, Alexandria City)
*2 Knowledge (Local, Ubrekt City)
*1 Knowledge (Local, Wydmoor)
*2 Sense Motive

===Level 6: [[Professional]] 5===
*Level Feat: Leadership
*Bonus Feat: Skill Focus (Diplomacy)
*1 Diplomacy
*1 Gather Info
*2 Knowledge (Local, Ubrekt City)
*1 Listen
*1 Sense Motive
*1 Search
*1 Spot
*3 Perform (Oration)

===Level 7: [[Dragoman]] 1===
*Class Feature: Silver Tongue
*Class Feature: Bonus Language ([[Ssel'it|Lizardmanlander]])
*2 Diplomacy
*2 Gather Info
*1 Sense Motive
*1 Listen
*1 Spot
*3 Knowledge (Nobility + Royalty)
*1 Knowledge (Local, Wydmoor)

===Level 8: Bard 1===
*Stat Bonus: Charisma
*Spells: [[Deftness]], Detect Magic, Mage Hand, Message
*1 Bluff
*1 Gather Info
*1 Intimidate
*1 Sense Motive
*3 Knowledge (History)
*2 Perform (Oration)

===Level 9: [[Dragoman]] 2===
*Feat: Skill Focus (Sense Motive)
*Class Feature: Skill Mastery (Sense Motive)
*Class Feature: Bonus Language (Odessan)
*2 Diplomacy
*1 Gather Info
*3 Knowledge (Geography)
*1 Listen
*1 Profession (Law)
*1 Search
*1 Sense Motive
*1 Spot

===Level 10: [[Professional]] 6===
*1 Diplomacy
*1 Gather Info
*2 Knowledge (Arcana)
*2 Knowledge (Local, Wydmoor)
*3 Knowledge (Nature)
*1 Profession (Law)
*1 Sense Motive

==Notes for Future Levels==

===Level 11: [[Professional]] 7===
*Bonus Feat: Improved Aid Another
*1 Bluff
*1 Diplomacy
*1 Gather Info
*1 Knowledge (Geography)
*1 Knowledge (History)
*1 Knowledge (Nobility)
*1 Intimidate
*1 Listen
*1 Search
*1 Sense Motive
*1 Spot
*'''Note:''' Give my earring to Egg

===Level 12: [[Professional]] 8===
*Level Feat: Luck of Heroes
*Level Stat Bonus: Charisma
*1 Diplomacy
*1 Gather Info
*2 Knowledge (Arcana)
*1 Knowledge (Nature)
*2 Knowledge (Religion)
*1 Listen
*1 Search
*1 Sense Motive
*1 Spot

[[Category:PC Character Sheets]]

RP: Shameless Self-Promotion

2011-07-28T15:52:56Z

146.127.253.44:

Under the incessant pounding of {{Kimika}}'s Ring of the Ram, the stone slab standing between the [[Wydmoor Thieves' Guild|Guild's]] trapped tomb and the fresh, clean air crumbles away. As you emerge from the catacombs and looks around, you see looks of dismay and agitation on all of your friends' faces, but none so intense as that of {{Germain}}. He sputters and stammers, clearly wanting to speak, but in place of his usual incessant and tiresome dialog, there is little more than red-faced silence. He turns to face the group, closes his eyes, and takes a few deep breaths, and finally manages a sentence:

; {{Germain}} : It's not that we were lied to. It's not that we walked into a trap. I expected both. It's that we are little more than lap dogs, begging for tasks and treats to win favor in the eyes of a bunch of incompetents. The guild and the wraiths have forced our hand time and time again, and once more we have accepted it without complaint, unwilling to set our own path! Don't you see that these people will never win this war? This whole damn issue was caused by the Wraith's politicking. They have tied themselves up with the Odessans with the hopes of currying some sort of political capital for themselves, and were caught with their dicks in their hands. And all they can do is turtle in their little castle, hoping for someone to save them. The Guild, on the other hand, has stepped from the shadows, and despite the fact that their behavior has weakened the city considerably, they have managed to twist our arms to help them build smuggling routes and deal with their own internal strife without risking their own necks. And I'm sure they have been rewarded by our goddamn compliance! We are nothing more than a bunch of fucking lackeys! What are we trying to save? Bricks and stones? The people of Wydmoor are dying alone, while we scramble to help a bunch of cowering nobles, politicking mercenaries, and opportunistic thieves! We are the only people that seem to be willing to stick our necks out to save this city, and yet we can't seem to pull our heads out of our asses and do what needs to be done! All we can manage to do is run errands for the bastards that put the city in this position in the first place! What the hell are we doing?!?

{{Germain}} glowers and fumes.

{{Al}} finds himself in the odd position of completely agreeing with {{Germain}} on matters of politics.

; {{Al}} : Yeah, dude! I still don't really get why everyone's so worried about who gets to sit at what table in what room, but I'm all for dumping the lot of them and just helping the people who need help! Stick it to the man! Let's go take all the food, medicine, etc from the rich folks and give it to the people who need it. But that's just a stopgap. What we really need to do is help these people learn to survive on their own! Teach them how to grow their own food and live off the land, outside these horrible walls.

; {{Kimika}} looks up thoughtfully. : "I agree with you both and I desperately want to help the people of Wydmoor; the ones who are suffering. What do you suggest we do, Germain?"

; {{Quinalin}} snorts then replies in a dispirited tone, : "I recall, though it seems like years ago, we got started in this city by trying to distribute wealth to the citizens so they could buy the right to vote for someone who would stand up for them. All that got them was burned out of their homes. We tried to take down one corrupt and evil official, and now it feels like there is nothing but corruption or at least pure self-interest. We can't just take over the city for ourselves. The Odessans don't seem to be interested in helping anyone. I don't see many good choices here although I would be happy to have my eyes opened.

; {{Egg}} : I don't think you're wrong, either of you, not exactly, but I think you're all "missing the Owlbear." Err, that doesn't translate so cleanly, but you get the idea, maybe? Everyone we worth with... for? They all have *agendas*. Plans and goals. What do we have? What do we want? If we want to help the refugees, why are we sitting with sacks overflowing with desperately needed healing gear settling personal vendettas in town? If we want to see the Odessans crushed, why do we refusing to leave sight of the city for more than a week at a time to strike against them? The Odessans, for all their advantages and strengths here, are spread across the mainland to the point that attacking them anywhere is attacking them everywhere. If we want is to see the Odessans gone, why are we not negotiating with them, especially now that their claims and demands are laid bare? We grab for everything and so take hold of nothing, and then direct our anger at those who employ us to their ends. Imagining, perhaps, that just because we all share the desire to lift the siege that all of our other desires are harmonious. It's appropriate we all meet in the "War Room." Because, while the war rages outside, another one is fought within. The war to save Wydmoor, and the war to rule it afterwards. Which war are we fighting? My partner talks easily of "doing what needs to be done," but what does that even mean? Might as well say we want to "make the world a better place" or "oppose evil." It's nice talk for a sermon, but not much of a plan of action. An easy, comfortable thought, and a good line to rouse the masses, but something the Silverwalkers seem to have struggled to nail down for as long as I've worked with you. Without any personal goals it is certainly convenient and profitable to work for those who do, but don't expect their agendas to make room for our pet issues.

; {{Germain}} : Exactly. Each of those acts you mention, Quinn, were another's plans... we were only the executors. Perhaps these plans were really mistakes, but they might also be plans within plans. These plans certainly benefited '''someone''', perhaps even the person who brought them to us. How can you say they didn't match our agenda? We don't have an agenda! It's time we did. Don't kid yourselves--we'll make plenty of mistakes, but that is no reason to refuse to make decisions. We have many irons in the fire right now, and while we have been negligent in working all of them, we are left with many options. Do we find a way to save the refugees? Do we deepen the schism within the guild? Do we throw the Wraiths to the wolves as punishment for their political machinations that brought us here? Do we expedite the foundation of the Traveller's Temple in Wydmoor? Do we weigh in against Odessa in their other conflicts with the Wraiths in Alexia? Do we open up a new conflict for them in Celestia? It's time to pick the projects we feel are most decisive, and use our time to drive them. The power brokers that rule this city have failed to protect it--it's time to become power brokers ourselves to set things right. Now, what do we do first?

; {{Mose}} : By Alexandria, Germain-- did an air elemental drop you on your head or something? We are on a mission of our own already. I feel like we've been driving our quest for Good all along. Sure, we've been used and abused, but ''(waving his sword over his head)'' we've also done our share of abusing, too! I'm convinced at this stage that we've already been smacked around and abused too much by these vampires and this Thieves Guild. We need to put an end to that and I'm even more convinced now that they fooled us into this trap. I don't want to do *anything* but continue to attack them. Sure, perhaps it's important to jump in and ''(with condescension)'' diplomaticize with various groups, but there's one thing I have learned is that you ''never'' turn your back on a thief, let alone an entire guild of them. That goes doubly for vampires, wererats, and ''(trying to catch up with his mouth)'' undead vampire wizarding assassins. They will thwart us behind the scenes at every turn, as they have so many times, if we back away. Let's hit them as hard as possible while there's a chance they think we're dead in their trap. We'll have time enough to do ''(trying to use proper grammar)'' powerbroking once we've shown the rest of the city that we won't tolerate evil in this town, and that there's finally someone in town that can stand up to it.

; {{Germain}} : No doubt we've been fighting the good fight, but we've been doing little more than reacting and we have not been working towards a larger plan. Routing the Guild, even if they are weakened by an internal schism, is not a matter of hours or even days. It's weeks or months of our undivided attention, plus the attention of most of the [[Azure Geese|Geese]]. In that time, what will happen? It's unlikely that anything will change with the refugees, and the rest of them will probably die. No one will launch an assault on the Odessans and they will have more time to recuperate and regroup for another attack of their own. Are we ok with that? The point is, even though we've been doing good deeds, we've been all over the place and it shows in the sustainability of our work. The time we spent helping the refugees only prolonged their suffering, because when we left them behind and ignored them, half of them died just the same. If the Theives Guild, the Wraiths, the Odessans, or someone in [[Sherdam]] pisses off the lizard folk--probably far too likely--they may unleash those guardians on the swamp just the same as our blackguard friend did. And if we only manage to get half-way into routing the guild before we wander off on another project, they'll regroup and slide into the shadows, and we'll be back where we started. I think the Guild is a time sink--lots of work with a low chance of success. We know little to nothing about the vampire, but I suspect that it has been active in Wydmoor for over 700 years in near-complete secrecy despite some high-profile accomplishments. It is going to take a lot of time and manpower to make an impact on its organization. Frankly, it would probably be quicker and easier to win a personal war on the entire Odessan army than it would be to take the Guild. Regarding the refugees, however, I think we possess the political capital and lack the opposition to solve their problem more permanently, and perhaps even bring them back into the city, in less than a week. So... are you sure a war against the guild is really the right course now?

; {{Al}} : Solve the refugee problem how? If we bring them into the city, won't they just starve and die of disease here instead of where they are now? I'd love to help the refugees, but just saying "solve their problem permanently" isn't a plan, and if we just move them around from place to place, what good does it do them? I'm no expert on the politics of refugees and war, so maybe I'm missing something, but it seems to me that the best way to help the refugees would be to end the war and get them back into their regular lives. Ideally, we could teach them the survival skills necessary to live off the land, but that's a longer term project.

{{LE}} likes to follow Germain's lead in matters like this. She listens, but only barely. Discussions like this are not her cup of tea.

; {{Germain}} : The city keeps a significant grain reserve to protect against seiges like this one. It's a function of their history--since Wydmoor gained its independence after a long seige, their founders provisioned to be able to sustain another. Given this year's long growing season, the decimation of the population through disease and fire, and the fact that the Mayor only released a pittiance of the grain to the refugees, these reserves should be abundant. It's not lack of grain that has caused the refugees to starve--its the fact that the mayor refused to release it and the wraiths can't move it through occupied territory. Inside the city, there should be enough to weather a long seige.

; {{Al}} : Ok, so say we get the refugees into the city. How do we know the city will give them food? I'm not suggesting that we shouldn't get them into the city (assuming the food is really available), just that we ought to have some assurance that the food will be given to them. How do we know, for example, that whoever's in charge of the food won't keep it for themselves? I mean, who's to say they aren't planning for a years-long siege? Or that the slimy city leaders aren't just greedy bastards who don't care if a bunch of refugees die? I've seen enough of how cities are run to know that the leaders don't necessarily have their residents' best interests as a priority. Personally, I think we should tear down all walls in all cities and teach people to live as nature intended, but, again, that's more of a long-term project. Short-term, I'm all for getting the food to the people who need it by whatever means necessary. I just think we need a plan other than "trust the greedy bastards to do what's right." I'm completely ok with part of that plan being "the Silverwalkers find the food and forcibly take it from the greedy bastards."

OOC (Trav): Assume the preceding has "dude" and "stick it to the man" scattered throughout. Also, maybe a tangent to talk about the process of growing grain in the wild.

OOC (GM): It's stops being the wild once you cultivate it. ;)

OOC (Trav): Who said anything about cultivation?

; {{Kimika}} brightens at the talk of getting the refugees into the city. She sits down and prays furtively for Alexandria's help in saving these people. : Many of the refugees are sick. I could summon a small herd of bison to pull wagons with refugees toward the city. However, much of the warrens are still burnt down and resources in that respect would be more limited. Perhaps we could establish a permanent residence for the refugees in the Landing? {{Kimika}} sighs. "I'm no good at planning. I do want to save the refugees, not only for their sake but so Bethnalay's death won't be in vain."

; {{Egg}} : I think it's going to take more than a few dozen bison summoned for an hour or two to get thousands of sick and dying people moved - through siege lines and enemy occupied land - into a city that actively doesn't want them. Don't get me wrong, Kimi, I'm not saying your idea is impossible, or even that it's bad. It's just, well, like the gnomes say "Dream Big, Scheme Big." Even the most radical things being suggested are not impossible, not in a world that saw Gracklek's castle fly: seizing the grain supply, relocating all of the refugees, *smiles at Quin*, hells, even "taking over the city." More has been done by fewer, but never by accident and never by increment. I think, Al, you get to the heart of our problem in regards to the refugees. Not the disease, part, though. I don't know that the Odessans have left us with enough materials to clear the poxes from camp, but certainly to alleviate their woes now that the hobgoblin reavers have taken their vengeance. However, all reports are that Onrarch is essentially a ruin now: the Onrarch Halflings have taken to flight since the death of Bethanalay and abscondment of Maggr and his outriders, relying about the Concord Traditions to let them slip passed the Ubrekti closed borders. Since then, the Odessans have taken no notice of them and the Free City has been unable to send any more food or aid past the siege lines. Now, if that aid would move even if it could is anybody's guess. As several of us have suggested, the commoners are an ancillary concern to the Powers That Be in Wydmoor, even the Bog Wraiths. I don't know that they're "greedy", exactly. Well, some of them certainly are, and I suppose to us most of them seem that way - but to you, Al, burning a forest seems like a high crime while to the Bog Wraiths it is just a matter of common sense: easier to replant a grove than unraze a city. To them, so long as the city stands, new bodies will flood in to replace the old. Laborers. Farmers. Desperate men and women hoping for a better life. These are not in short supply in the world we live in. They do the work and clean the shit, but make none of the decisions and are infinitely replaceable. *scowls* I'm acquainted intimately with the mindset, but I think we should have learned by now that assigning moral values to these decisions - and leveling moral judgement against those making them - does nothing but hurt us in the long run. They have their priorities and concerns, and we have ours. Where they overlap, we can work together... but where they conflict? Hmmm. But, that's just me thinking out loud again. Al's right about one thing: the plight of the refugees is not the concern of the Wraiths, or anyone else for that matter. Edrell is about the only person who has ever done much for them, and who is to say if that kindness and support was from compassion or political calculus?

; {{Germain}} : Don't understimate us. Once the refugees are in the city, its much easier than you think to make sure they are taken care of. Whether you realise it or not, I've been very careful with my politicing to create a situation where only the Geese and the Silverwalkers have any real capital with the refugees. If they receive the grain and care they need, we are probably the only ones that can keep them peaceful and the city running normally. If they do not receive what they need and we retaract our support, I can assure that there will be riots. In another time, the riots would be easy enough to suppress, but with the Odessans at our door it's a strain on the city's defenses. Also, you are underestimating our ability as power players to force the issue once the excuses about supply lines and sieges are gone. The powers-that-be are well aware of all of this, so we will almost certainly have to play hardball to get them to help us, but once they are here I think providing for them will be a much simpler task. I'm not, to be clear, advocating that this should be our number one priority. This is a task where we have a reasonable chance for a quick, successful turnaround, will garner us significant capital in the city, and is morally "correct" and compasionate. I also think it's far more workable and viable plan than attacking the guild directly. But there are other plans out there to consider if we feel like another task is more important than the lives of the refugees.

; {{Egg}} : *If* the refugees were in the city, the threat of riot would be a real one, don't you mean? Where they are currently, outside of the walls and on the wrong side of an opposing army army, their ability to influence the city is nil. Hells, that's probably one of the many reasons no one of influence wants them back.

; {{Kimika}} brightens and speaks excitedly. : "Travelers outpost! What if we went to the refugee camp and remade it into a Travelers Outpost, setting up a more organized and permanent settlement there? If we claim it is Travelers, and thus an extension of the Alexandrian church, we can get resources through by means of the church. This also fulfills Mose's dreams. The church will also be thrilled because it gives them a stronghold near Wydmoor, which is completely up in the airstride as the Church's official stance is that no cleric can participate in a war but only give aid. Now is the time! I also would like to shift my focus of my clerical duties from education to learning how to allow people to travel more effectively. It may be a far-shot, sure, but no one other than us could make this happen! Let's do this!"

; {{Egg}} : Now we're thinking big, at least! Sadly, Kimika, as audacious a plan as that is, I don't think we have the influence to pull it off. Mose doesn't have the authority to set up outposts wherever he wants. We might as well declare ourselves Kings and Queens for all the power we'd have to enforce such a claim. If the Church had any desire to get involved in this, they'd have done so well before now. That doesn't mean they couldn't be *forced* to become involved somehow, but that kind of grand scheming is beyond me, I'm sad to say. I think that you bring up good points, though, Kimi. Something has to be done with the refugees - something *organized*. What good will it do to ease their sickness only to have them die of starvation, or even kill each other once everyone is healthy enough to take advantage of the lawnessness. Also, I think you've hit on something else, Kimi: whatever we do, as influential as we've become and as much clout as we have with the refugees, we're going to need *someone* of import supporting whatever our final plan is: either publicly or privately. We're rich, competent, and respected enough that other people need us for their schemes. I imagine we're going to learn with a quickness that runs both ways.

{{Germain}} ponders who might support us.

; {{Quinalin}} : I don't know enough about the siege protections the city has other than the teleport barrier, but is there any way we could wholesale smuggle the people into the city? We have a huge burned out area that is mostly unattended.. could we have a fleet of giant badgers headed by Al dig a tunnel route through to the refugees with Kimi providing rock-to-mud and such? I could craft deadfalls to protect the tunnel and render it impassible once we were done with it.. You mentioned Gracklek's castle... could we fly them in? Create a large cloud cover and hover them in on levitating barges? As far as what Egg was saying about pulling strings, I think we could probably try to lean on Edrell to look the other way for some piece of the magical protections that he is administrating.

; {{Egg}} :
Even among burnt out ruins, they've gotta be better of inside the city than outside: access to water and food, some measure of law and order. Assuming we can stop them from bringing the Pox in with them, that is. Nothing would sour the Silverwalkers reputation more than smuggling plague into the city. You know, Quin, that's actually... quite clever. Not the flying, I think that's probably beyond any of us, but that other thing. I was thinking actually getting them *into* the city was an all but insurmountable problem of its own. But, yeah, it's quite simple, really. If we could get them *to* the city walls, somehow, then some sort of army of tunneling creatures or whatever it is Al does might be sufficient to get them inside. Best case, you're talking a day of work between the digging and the moving, and the Wraiths or whoever could easily move to intervene if they found out, with force if necessary, I've no doubt. I suppose even a Stone to Mud spell would cut that time down into the hours, but then we'd definitely need someone backing out play. No one would appreciate us melting a hole in the one thing staving off a good, old fashioned city razing, although a few Wall of Stone spells might patch up the damage. I doubt it would be that easy, though. I imagine whatever sorts of wards and spells enchant the walls would be severely damaged by poking holes in the wall. If the wall isn't, indeed, impervious to that sort of thing outright. It would have to be, right? Otherwise one or two of those University wizards they have stashed away someplace would just liquefy the Wraith's walls and that'd be that. But, the tunneling idea might just work. The Odessans have proven its efficacy. Sometimes the 'boring' solutions are the best, right? *chuckles* I think you're right, Quin, that Edrell is our best bet as an accomplice or whatever you want to call it for however this goes down. Him or the Guild, probably, and correct me if I'm wrong, but I'd think working with the guild on any future projects is off the table. So, Edrell. Protecting the Forager's Gate is his responsibility, so he'd be able to force the issue if he so desired, or perhaps use magic to obfuscate our ruse. Also, these are ostensibly "his" people, so if anyone other that you guys gives a Alexian penny about the refugees, it's him. Now, that only leaves the other impossible problem of getting thousands of half-starved and disease ridden refugees from Onrarch to the city walls themselves. It's far too many to move magically without some sort of permanent portal emplacement, a task far beyond any of us - Edrell included, I feel safe in saying. Whatever we do among the refugees, however, will have to be done carefully and quietly. The Odessans seem to be willing to leave the camp alone, as their supply lines have no need of the river, but we're no doubt almost as well known to them as we are to our own people, and catching wind of us engaging in some sort of unknown mischief in the camps will draw undue and probably violent attention.

; {{Germain}} : All this talk about tunnels makes reminds me that there is another way into the city that may not require burrowing through the its defensive fortifications. Edrell's new digs--the Magus' Keep--is outside the city walls, maintains its own defensive and magical fortifications, and is connected to the city by something that is decidedly not a tunnel--the [[Non-Tunnel]]. Can this device move thousands of people? Is this a more viable entrance into the city? No matter how we breach the city walls, we might expect a fight from the Wraiths or another agency, but Edrell may well open his gates for them. If we can get them to the keep, is there a viable way to move them into the city, or at least more easily provide for them?

; {{Egg}} : Hmmm. Sure, I don't see why not, Germain. Moving hundreds - or even thousands - of people at once is what those sort of permanent gate/portals are for. That would definitely require Edrell's collaboration.

; {{Quinalin}} : It might be possible to move the tunnel much further outside the reach of the city walls than you'd think, I wouldn't put anything past Al's ability to dig. I remember how quickly he worked to dig us safeholes and to do that sapping work on the orc village. I'd love to see if the Non-Tunnel might provide an easier way for us to move the people than breaching the city proper. The pox part is the biggest problem I see with the plan. What about the Temporal Authority? I know they declined Ralth's plan of declaring war, but could we possibly pop over to Daltim or near by with the cap, and beg them for some major healing to ease the suffering of the refugees so we can enact our plan to bring them to relative safety?

; {{Mose}} : Now I'm all for foolhardy adventurers using makeshift badger tunnels and risking our lives to them, but the dwarves have a saying ''(something in dwarven)'' that roughly translates to "A hasty mineshaft is a permanent grave". Unless you've got crafty dwarves planning such a tunnel or magic to keep it from caving-in, we may be setting ourselves up for a catastrophe worse than the alternative. Especially if someone sinister hears of our plan and tries to thwart it. While I very much want to help the refugees more than anything, we're also going to need ways to prevent any infiltrators from hitching a ride... Do we want more sneaky disguised hobgoblin attacks in the city? If the city is a mess now, it doesn't do anyone any good to make it worse. And finally... I still think we can't turn our back on the Thieves Guild! Anything we do, they will continue to thwart us and cause problems. They know we are hunting them, and they are going to very big lengths to exterminate us. '''Why''' in Alexandria's name would be ignoring such evil that absolutely wants to kill us and stop anything we do? Do you not recall the wererats were helping the Odessans in the sewer to try to kill '''everyone''' in the city with poisoned water supply? How they launched a hit on us just a day or so ago and almost killed Kimi? If we don't take them out, I think they will continue to try to kill us once they discover their trap failed (barely) to ruin us. Germain, you mean with all of your Silver Goosies, you can't get us a better lead on how to hit the Thieves Guild hard?

; {{Quinalin}} : Fair points Mose. Anyone know of a way we might be able to recruit a few dwarven sappers to help me shore up the tunnel? I'd be happy to set up two plans here. Maybe we continue to see if we can continue to flesh out the tunnel plan which involves architecture, medical, and transportation. While we start work on that, I'd be happy to take it to the Thieves Guild using the surprise of our survival, as long as we aren't going up against odds as implausible as going out to the field and charging the Odessan field command.

; {{Egg}} : A question for you, Mose. Ignore for a moment that the Guild has the present support of the Bog Wraiths, and assume we do decide to declare war on them. What would "attacking the Thieves' Guild" look like? What buildings would we raze? Who would we kill? We only know one person in the Guild - Fenn. We could kidnap him and torture some information out of him, I suppose, but after that ambush he unknowingly sent us into, I'd say we have every reason to doubt his knowledge. I guess we could wipe out those people we suspect of guild collaboration among the Guardsmen, but I'm not sure how comfortable you're going to be, Mose, conducting an extra-legal purge based on circumstance and heresy. Now, don't get me wrong, Mose. I'd love to see the Guild hurt, and I absolutely agree they are a bigger threat to us, personally, than even the Odessans. Not to mention, I'm pretty sure Germain still hungers for the day when it's Fenn's severed head shoved in a box. But, in a way, our backs are *always* turned on the Guild. Anyone could be working for them, anyone could be one of their spies. Germain is suggesting that the Guild leader is pushing a thousand, and is probably a vampire to boot. If the Guild is truly a centuries old and established - yet still mostly invisible - institution, where would we even begin to direct our attack? I think you're right that the Germain and the Geese could probably sniff out some leads to begin, but is this going to be the work of days? Months, most likely, with the Guild - and possibly the Wraiths and others - opposing our campaign from the outset. The Dwarves of the War College like to say there are three things needed to win a war: Proper Intelligence, Proper Materials, and the Proper Season. Which of those do we currently have in regards to a war with the Guild? Honestly, however, I wouldn't count on the Guild thinking we're dead. A trap that sophisticated - with a set of Greater Elementals - is an expensive proposition. If I'd set up such a place, I'd make sure I watched directly instead of just presupposing the outcome. If only to see a good fight. Now, I don't know this for sure, but I expect the Guild already knows we survived. Now, none of this means we *couldn't* somehow take this war to the Guild, only the reasons why it would be difficult and dangerous. But, so is everything we're discussing, I suppose.

{{Germain}} nods, and although he occasionally looks like he wants to interject, he does not have anything to add to Egg's synopsis.

; {{Quinalin}} : Bah! Egg, I hate to think you might be right that they already know we escaped because if they didn't, well, to keep the string of adages going.. the Petarans say you should ever watch for the opportunity to use your opponent's own move as the next step in your blade dance. I think it would be fairly easy for us to quickly replace or disguise the broken door and then set an ambush for the people that would be bound to come look over the results of their trap. If we captured one of them and put a charm on them then we could take the place of the others in that group and have the charmed person take us back to whoever was responsible for the trap. If it was outside the city then we would even have the possibility of capping away if necessary. Otherwise, we might look into the outstanding question of whether dimension door works to get us out of whatever rat nest we end up in after we take advantage of any opportunity to strike back at a person at least partially responsible for trying to wipe us out.

; {{Al}} : A few points.. Rock-to-mud doesn't work on worked stone, so that's out. We could rock-to-mud under the wall, but that might be bad for the wall too, and we'd still have to move the mud somewhere, and mud's not easy to move around. As for burrowing.. This might be fun to try, but it seems impractical. Al-as-badger could do a lot of digging, but we need a LOT of digging. I could summon a few extra badgers to help, but we're still talking about hundreds of feet of tunnel that has to be wide enough for lots of people at a time to walk through. The time that it would take to dig would, I think, be very long (days maybe), and where would all the dug-out dirt go? I suspect someone might notice a huge pile of dirt growing outside the city walls. Even if they didn't, and we somehow made a nice tunnel, how long would it take to usher thousands of refugees through it? That itself could take days, unless we made the tunnel huge, which would be impractical. The refugees would be in a very dangerous position for many hours at least. So would we, I suspect, since we wouldn't want to leave them to their own devices for that long. Digging is tons of fun when you're a badger, so I hate to be so pessimistic, but I'd hate it more if all the refugees we were trying to save died because of our "rescue." Dudes.

; {{Quinalin}} attempting to do an impression of Al : Dude! What a buzz-kill. I never expected you to be the stuffy guy bringing down our lofty goals like a herd of city garden planners. Just kidding. I guess I was so impressed by your work back at the Orc camp I thought it might be possible to craft a 10 or 15 foot wide tunnel long enough to go under the wall within a few days if you had the help of some war-spell summoned badgers. I understand what you are saying. Getting them to Eldrell's outpost is still a possibility we haven't determined infeasible yet, right?

; {{Egg}} : I hate that Al and I are such buzzkills, but I suppose better to be buzzkilled than kill-killed. I'd say, yes, we haven't found a reason we couldn't up and move the refugees. There are lots of things that make it difficult: the disease, the poor nutrition, the walls of pikemen guarding Ubrekt's north border. But, problems lust for solutions. And, as Germain has said, if we can somehow convince Edrell to let us use the Not-Tunnel, all this 'boring' *chuckles again* conversation is moot. I mean, I'm sure the Hadriarch will be less than thrilled when thousands of refugees start streaming up through the basement, but I doubt they have the means to do more than complain about it.

Talk:Lizardfolk

2011-02-09T13:56:16Z

146.127.253.44: The edit fail returns!

So, they're more saurian than reptilian. That makes more sense for a sentient race, anyway, since the energy required to run a brain is pretty astronomical, and generally outside the capability of exothermic lifeforms.

Not that magic doesn't have a say, of course. -[[User:Slitherrr|Slitherrr]]

: Nah, I'm with you - there's a place for bean plating. Besides, other than the steamy bog of the Temporal Authority, most the swamps are in temperate areas with pretty rough winter. Can't have my lizards die off every winter. -gm

:: Hibernation, on the other hand, would actually make for some very interesting cultural mores, I think. It wouldn't fit here, but maybe a reptilian race on another continent would be a fun forum in which to explore the concept. -[[User:Slitherrr|Slitherrr]]

::: Ooo Ooo Or, your lizards live for about 10 months eggs hatch in the spring and they pass their culture through some strange genetic memory! -[[User:Feantari|Feantari]]

For some reason, I thought this was a lost race like the naga. Obviously, I was wrong. Were they just lost from the wydmoor swamp, or am I just crazy? --[[User:Msallen|Msallen]]
: Jones has always talked about them as if they weren't lost. Generally, Lizardfolk are relegated to areas that don't have much interest for other races, so I think this is more of an "out of touch" issue than "lost". -[[User:Slitherrr|Slitherrr]]
:: No. The lost race is literally called The Lost for the love of pete. I try to make things simple for you, Matt. Do try and keep up. -gm
::: So the Naga aren't lost either? ;) --[[User:Msallen|Msallen]]
:::: THESE BURNS ARE SO SICK THEY NEED TO BE HOSPITALIZED. -[[User:Slitherrr|Slitherrr]]
:::: Well, the Naga are EXTINCT. The Lost are just... Lost. You know, somewhere that is not here. -gm
::::: (hint: they're in Detroit) -[[User:Slitherrr|Slitherrr]]
::: The elves seem fairly lost, too, right? --[[User:Mattie|Mattie]]

Germain's Character Sheet

2010-12-06T13:29:22Z

146.127.253.44: Bard 2 isn't good enough to make the cut yet

Player: [[User:Msallen|MSAllen]] 
Name: [[Germain]] 
Classes/Levels: [[Professional]] 5, Bard 1, [[Dragoman]] 1, Ranger 1 
Race: [[Human]] 
Alignment: N 
Origin: [[Fresia]]/[[Flannary]] 
Residence: [[Wydmoor Free City]] 

==Attributes==

===Primary===
{|
|Strength||  ||10 (+0)
|-
|Dexterity||  ||12 (+1)
|-
|Constitution||  ||12 (+1)
|-
|Intelligence||  ||14 (+2)
|-
|Wisdom||  ||14 (+2)
|-
|Charisma||  ||16 (+3) [4th and 8th level attribute bonus]
|}

===Secondary===
{|
|Hit Points||  ||62||  ||9 + 9 + 8 + 8 + 8 + 8 + 6 + 6
|-
|Armor Class||||18||||+3 studded leather, +3 dex bonus (+2 to Dex bonus from insightful defense), +2 [[Barbarian King's Buckler|shield]]
|-
|Armor Class||||19||||+5 chain mail, +2 dex bonus (+2 to Dex bonus from insightful defense, -1 from chainmail max Dex), +2 [[Barbarian King's Buckler|shield]]
|-
|Base Attack Bonus||||+4||||
|-
|Initiative||||+1||||
|-
|Base Speed||||30 ft./20 ft.||||studded leather/chain mail
|-
|Fort Save||||+5||||+1 professional 5, +2 ranger 1, +1 stat, +1 [[Germain's_Character_Sheet#Ring_of_Tweets_(Greater)|ring]]
|-
|Reflex Save||||+12||||+4 professional 5, +2 bard 1, +2 dragoman 1, +2 ranger 1, +1 stat, +1 [[Germain's_Character_Sheet#Ring_of_Tweets_(Greater)|ring]]
|-
|Will Save||||+11||||+4 professional 5, +2 bard 1, +2 dragoman 1, +2 stat, +1 [[Germain's_Character_Sheet#Ring_of_Tweets_(Greater)|ring]]
|}

[[Table:_Leadership|Leadership]] Score: 13* Lvl + Chr + Mild Renown (1) + Fairness and Generosity (1) <-this will continue to cost you gold monthly. We can come up with a gp per follower per level formula when you get some real staff going on, or see if you want to drop the bonus at some point.

* This score assumes, probably correctly, that your lvl 8 stat boost goes into Charisma.

==Feats and Abilities==

===Purchased Feats===
*Combat Expertise
*Investigator (+2 search, +2 gather information)
*[[Knowledgeable]] (+1 all knowledge skills)
*Leadership
*Negotiator (+2 diplomacy, +2 sense motive)
*Persuader (+2 bluff, +2 intimidate)
*Skill Focus (Diplomacy)

===Class Feats===
*Bardic Knowledge +6 (+1 dragoman, +1 bard, +2 stat, +2 syn (knowledge (history)))
*Bardic Oration
*Countersong
*Fascinate
*Favored Enemy: Human
*Insightful Defense +2
*Inspire Courage +1
*Proficiency (Armor): Light, Medium
*Proficiency (Shield): Small, Large
*Proficiency (Weapon): Simple, Martial
*Silver Tongue (Charisma)
*Track +6 (+2 survival, +2 stat, +2 syn (search))
*Uncanny Dodge
*Wild Empathy +6 (+1 ranger, +3 stat, +2 syn (handle animal))

===Languages===
*Dwarven
*Flannari
*Fresian (??? regional variant)
*Hakni
*Ubrekti
*Odessan (training)

==Skills==
{|class=sortable
!Skill!!class=unsortable|  !!Bonus!!class=unsortable|  !!class=unsortable|Bonus Derivation
|-
|[http://www.d20srd.org/srd/skills/bluff.htm Bluff]||||15||||7 ranks, +3 stat, +2 persuader, +3 silver tongue
|-
|[http://www.d20srd.org/srd/skills/diplomacy.htm Diplomacy]||||27||||10 ranks, +3 stat, +2 negotiator, +3 skill focus, +6 syn (bluff, sm, nobility), +3 silver tongue
|-
|[http://www.d20srd.org/srd/skills/gatherInformation.htm Gather Information]||||19||||11 ranks, +3 stat, +2 investigator, +3 silver tongue
|-
|[http://www.d20srd.org/srd/skills/handleAnimal.htm Handle Animal]||||11||||5 ranks, +3 stat, +3 silver tongue
|-
|[http://www.d20srd.org/srd/skills/intimidate.htm Intimidate]||||15||||5 ranks, +3 stat, +2 persuader, +2 syn (bluff), +3 silver tongue
|-
|[http://www.d20srd.org/srd/skills/knowledge.htm Knowledge] (Geography)||||6||||2 ranks, +2 stat, +1 knowledgeable, +1 [[Germain's_Character_Sheet#Absolutely_Fabulous_Earring_of_Competence|earring]]
|-
|[http://www.d20srd.org/srd/skills/knowledge.htm Knowledge] (History)||||9||||5 ranks, +2 stat, +1 knowledgeable, +1 [[Germain's_Character_Sheet#Absolutely_Fabulous_Earring_of_Competence|earring]]
|-
|[http://www.d20srd.org/srd/skills/knowledge.htm Knowledge] (Local, Alexandria City)||||6||||2 ranks, +2 stat, +1 knowledgeable, +1 [[Germain's_Character_Sheet#Absolutely_Fabulous_Earring_of_Competence|earring]]
|-
|[http://www.d20srd.org/srd/skills/knowledge.htm Knowledge] (Local, Home)||||8||||4 ranks, +2 stat, +1 knowledgeable, +1 [[Germain's_Character_Sheet#Absolutely_Fabulous_Earring_of_Competence|earring]]
|-
|[http://www.d20srd.org/srd/skills/knowledge.htm Knowledge] (Local, Ubrekt City)||||10||||6 ranks, +2 stat, +1 knowledgeable, +1 [[Germain's_Character_Sheet#Absolutely_Fabulous_Earring_of_Competence|earring]]
|-
|[http://www.d20srd.org/srd/skills/knowledge.htm Knowledge] (Local, Wydmoor Free City)||||11||||7 ranks, +2 stat, +1 knowledgeable, +1 [[Germain's_Character_Sheet#Absolutely_Fabulous_Earring_of_Competence|earring]]
|-
|[http://www.d20srd.org/srd/skills/knowledge.htm Knowledge] (Nature)||||6||||2 ranks, +2 stat, +1 knowledgeable, +1 [[Germain's_Character_Sheet#Absolutely_Fabulous_Earring_of_Competence|earring]]
|-
|[http://www.d20srd.org/srd/skills/knowledge.htm Knowledge] (Nobility)||||9||||5 ranks, +2 stat, +1 knowledgeable, +1 [[Germain's_Character_Sheet#Absolutely_Fabulous_Earring_of_Competence|earring]]
|-
|[http://www.d20srd.org/srd/skills/knowledge.htm Knowledge] (Religion)||||6||||2 ranks, +2 stat, +1 knowledgeable, +1 [[Germain's_Character_Sheet#Absolutely_Fabulous_Earring_of_Competence|earring]]
|-
|Languages||||||||1 ranks
|-
|[http://www.d20srd.org/srd/skills/listen.htm Listen]||||10||||8 ranks, +2 stat
|-
|[http://www.d20srd.org/srd/skills/perform.htm Perform] (Oration)||||11||||5 ranks, +3 stat, +3 silver tongue
|-
|[http://www.d20srd.org/srd/skills/ride.htm Ride]||||6||||3 ranks, +2 syn (ha) +1 stat
|-
|[http://www.d20srd.org/srd/skills/search.htm Search]||||10||||6 ranks, +2 stat, +2 investigator
|-
|[http://www.d20srd.org/srd/skills/senseMotive.htm Sense Motive]||||15||||11 ranks, +2 stat, +2 negotiator
|-
|[http://www.d20srd.org/srd/skills/spot.htm Spot]||||10||||8 ranks, +2 stat
|-
|[http://www.d20srd.org/srd/skills/survival.htm Survival]||||4||||2 ranks, +2 stat
|}

==Notable Equipment==
===[[Barbarian King's Buckler]]===
* +1 buckler
* when first struck by a missile weapon in a round, you may make a DC 20 save to block the arrow
* any arrows passing within 10' the wielder are rerouted to him

===[[Coldheart Bow]]===
* +1 shortbow
* +1d6 cold damage on hits

===Horn of Haste===
* silver horn
* cast haste 2/day (as a 5th level caster)

===Absolutely Fabulous Earring of Competence===
* +1 to intelligence skill checks
* can be activated to cast Fox's Cunning, but skill bonus is lost for 24 hours

===Ring of E-Mail===
* ring of resistance +1 (all saves)
* can be activated to send a 20 word message to [[Edrell Odenthorpe|Edrell]], but protection is lost for 24 hours
* The E stands for Edrell.

===<del>Ring of Tweets</del>===
* once per day, may send a 10 word message to [[Edrell Odenthorpe|Edrell]]
* invisible for 2 rounds, at-will, 2-day
* stolen by that rat [[Fenn]]

==Advancement==
Starting Feats: Persuader, Investigator

===Level 1: [[Professional]] 1===
*Bonus Feat: [[Knowledgeable]]
*4 Bluff
*4 Diplomacy
*4 Gather Info
*4 Knowledge (Local, Wydmoor)
*4 Knowledge (Local, Home)
*2 Knowledge (Local, Ubrekt City)
*2 Knowledge (Nobility)
*2 Knowledge (Religion)
*2 Knowledge (Geography)
*2 Knowledge (History)
*4 Listen
*2 Search
*4 Sense Motive
*4 Spot

===Level 2: [[Professional]] 2===
*1 Bluff
*1 Diplomacy
*1 Gather Info
*2 Intimidate
*1 Listen
*2 Ride
*1 Search
*1 Sense Motive
*1 Spot

===Level 3: [[Professional]] 3===
*Level Feat: Combat Expertise
*Bonus Feat: Negotiator
*1 Bluff
*1 Diplomacy
*1 Gather Info
*1 Intimidate
*1 Knowledge (Local, Wydmoor)
*1 Listen
*1 Ride
*2 Search
*1 Sense Motive
*1 Spot

===Level 4: Ranger 1===
*Level Stat Bonus: Charisma
*Class Feature: Favored enemy: Human
*5 Handle Animal
*2 Knowledge (Nature)
*2 Survival

===Level 5: [[Professional]] 4===
*Class Feature: Uncanny Dodge
*Language: Dwarven
*1 Diplomacy
*1 Gather Info
*1 Intimidate
*2 Knowledge (Local, Alexandria City)
*2 Knowledge (Local, Ubrekt City)
*1 Knowledge (Local, Wydmoor)
*2 Sense Motive

===Level 6: [[Professional]] 5===
*Level Feat: Leadership
*Bonus Feat: Skill Focus (Diplomacy)
*1 Diplomacy
*1 Gather Info
*2 Knowledge (Local, Ubrekt City)
*1 Listen
*1 Sense Motive
*1 Search
*1 Spot
*3 Perform (Oration)

===Level 7: [[Dragoman]] 1===
*Class Feature: Silver Tongue
*2 Diplomacy
*2 Gather Info
*1 Sense Motive
*1 Listen
*1 Spot
*3 Knowledge (Nobility + Royalty)
*1 Knowledge (Local, Wydmoor)

===Level 8: Bard 1===
*Stat Bonus: Charisma
*Spells: [[Deftness]], Detect Magic, Mage Hand, Message
*1 Bluff
*1 Gather Info
*1 Intimidate
*1 Sense Motive
*3 Knowledge (History)
*2 Perform (Oration)

==Notes for Future Levels==

===Level 9 (option 1): [[Dragoman]] 2===
*Feat: Skill Focus (Sense Motive)
*Class Feature: Skill Mastery (Sense Motive)
*2 Diplomacy
*1 Gather Info
*1 Sense Motive
*3 Knowledge (Geography)
*4 Other

===Level 9 (option 2): [[Professional]] 6===
*Feat: Skill Focus (Sense Motive)
*2 Diplomacy
*1 Gather Info
*1 Sense Motive
*3 Knowledge (Geography or Nature)
*4 Other

[[Category:PC Character Sheets]]

Talk:Main Page

2010-12-02T14:54:26Z

146.127.253.44:

[http://turing.bard.edu/~mk561/frank_k_0.5.1.pdf] : A pretty awesome .pdf that .... some guys? .... put together. It's a LOT of crazy rule shit only good for the simulationist, but the chapters on economy and other races are phenomenal. Came out from the MeFi post about Lore's comic. (Which needs to start updating again.) -gm
: Oh my Omnity, what have I done? Please forgive me.
:: The more I read the book, the less I agree with "shit only good for the simulationist". Almost all of the rules rewrites are there to correct imbalances, not to make things more simulation-y, and most of them are less complicated than the original rules (like the treatment for grapple that replaces the messy labyrinth of complicated rules with a sensible set of actions, and also gets rid of the opposed rolls that make for a variance of 40 (!!) points on a given contest). I'm not saying this to argue that we should change mid-stride, because that would be chaos, but it might be something to think about for a future campaign when these are done. You know, when we're like forty or fifty years old. -[[User:Slitherrr|Slitherrr]]

: By which I mean major sections of this are going to become canon over the Christmas holidays. Starting with languages.
:: Holy fuck, the bit about the Aboleth in the "Empirinomicon" section is AWESOME. -[[User:Slitherrr|Slitherrr]]
::: After reading it, and then reading our own language section, our treatment is pretty close to the one in the ''TOME OF NECROMANCY,'' etc. etc. that you linked. We gloss over the Servitor languages, but we've also sufficiently hand-waved that into a question of cultural ignorance rather than canonical laziness. The only major changes I saw fit to add were to add regional qualifiers to some of Kib's languages (there are probably also other characters who need audits, notably Germain), and some more explanatory text on the [[Languages]] and [[List of Languages]] pages. -[[User:Slitherrr|Slitherrr]]
:::: Well, not a full on rules change, but more of a codification of flavor, but not going all the way into the million dialects flavor. The more I think about it, though, the less attractive it comes. I think we're in a pretty good place, happy medium wise. The Aboleth, yes, has become one of my favorite creatures literally overnight. Anyway, with the languages, I guess I liked the Pidgin and Creole discussions enough to want to incorporate them. In face, a lot of the langauges (the ones that end in -i, coincidentally, including Ubrekti itself) are Creoles that developed from regional dialects and Old Ubrekti. The ones with -n endings (Petaran, Odessan, Petaran) are from ethic groups powerful enough to have retained their own language (like, say, Greek.) I like what you've added, having just read it, and think we're on the same page.In fact, you've done a better job that I was even imagining - i actually wrote that bit about Pigin and Creole BEFORE I read your edit. (I'm reading them all and doing one big edit to not accidentally erase half of the talk page, like I have a .... history of.) Halfling, of course, just learned Ubrekti in the same way that, say, the Etruscans eventually just abandoned their native tongue for Latin. -gm
:::: One Eratta: As to the Lizard Men... If anyone cared enough to actually pay any attention to them, I think they'd find that Ssel'it has amazingly little variance to none at all. I wrote a little sentence as a hint that I had to strike for being too spoilerly, but suffice it to say there is a reason for the uniformity and it makes sense. Hint: Lizardman Racial Class is Druid. Hmmmmmmm.
:::: Also down with renaming. I've actually gotten into the spoke habit of referring to the language and the people of the dwarves as Gilden. Because, I mean, Gilden Home. It's not rocket science. Gnomish, OTOH, I hadn't really thought about in those terms. Hmmmm. -gm
::::: Reading a few more changes it, I see we are once again on the same page. Time for me to Secret Page this bitch. (Another trick I learned from this book!) -gm
::::: Read Econimocon from the beginning - I backed into the last half last night. It's worth noting, if only for backpatting purposes, that I preempted some of these concerns. Monetary policy was one of my thoughts putting this campaign together - banks and states (with large bank accounts) have been major actors from the beginning. I'm not done yet, but I think there's a place in his discussion for the idea of patronage. Essentially spreading out money as a sort of personalized social service program has been effective from Roman Patricians to modern Hamas. But, yeah, it is kind of sad how tiny dragon hordes have to be by the mechanics. Since there are really no Wyrm-tiered dragons in this game, and usually believe in a 1 or 2 dragons per campaign ever rule, I usually go with the You Are Fucking Rich option. My thoughts at the time, since we never got to the Alexandria endgame, was that by the time the party got around to taking out the last dragons, they'd be to the point that these coins were basically social currency and probably funded a pretty substantial portion of the campaign in her absence. Of course, I also just don't think some dragons horde. Black Dragons, for example, or really anyone who doesn't live in a cave. -gm
:::::: Econimicon was the first I read after Lexicomicon, and yes, it's extremely enlightening. The fact that we're sitting on a mere 100 gp in COPPER and finding it hard to carry definitely contributes a lot of insight. -[[User:Slitherrr|Slitherrr]]
::::::: Oh god, I tried to read the economicon section and all this simulationist insanity is making my eyes bleed. Who cares how much coins weigh? I barely tolerate the lightly obnoxious attention that Jones pays to this... Hell, well over half the time he tells me loot numbers I just convert to gold! Money is as heavy or small as it needs to be for the game to be fun--when its in a dragon horde its huge, and when my PC is shopping it all fits in his pocket. Thinking about the weight of gold is about as entertaining as thinking about how my character stores his matches. Creating a hierarchy of currency systems to deal with the weight of gold is downright horrifying. Bleach! I suggest an alternative system where we convert everything into gold coins with two decimals of precision, so that my 157 silver and 13 copper become 15.83 gold! Now that's progress! --[[Special:Contributions/146.127.253.44|146.127.253.44]]

Also - it's a shame Daniel hates retconning so much. Those artisan rules would be right up his alley. -gm

I have to say, I really like the stuff in the Economicon. I'm going to even put in some possible changes in a section on Kib's character sheet in case you end up integrating all/most of it. -[[User:Slitherrr|Slitherrr]]
: I really LOVE all the -micon section. Whoever the hell these two are, have put a lot of really awesome though into HOW a truly fantastical, hero-based setting would operate and the long term ramification of some of the weirdo stuff tossed into D&D. (Like the Aboleth ability, or the Sahuagin) There is one part, somewhere, where the point is made that the analogue for D&D isn't the "middle ages" at all. Small patches of civilization surrounded by frightening wilderness? Small bands of heroes toppling empires? That's not Chaucer, that's fucking HOMER. D&D is an iron age mindset in medieval clothing. I read that part and was like "Holy shit, that's what *I've* always thought. These guys get it*. And then I looked up and it was bedtime and I'd read like half the document. If you haven't gotten to the part about aristocrats and heroes, I laughed out loud through it. Amazing work. -gm
:: Quite. -[[User:Slitherrr|Slitherrr]]
::: The tone of loving mockery makes it very readable. It's like Aristotle and Lao-Tzu got together and answered every D&D argument that ever arose over mountain dew, pizza, hootch, and/or weed. There you go! Now that we’re all on the same page(page XX)-gm

The NPC class section is, in a word, ''genius''. -[[User:Slitherrr|Slitherrr]]

The host for this document is a computer science department at Bard, which is sort of a pretentious, expensive college focusing in the fine arts. Maybe the authors must represent some sort of bizarre intersection of engineering obsessiveness and artist creativity. And at least one of them knows the LaTeX typesetting language. Weird --[[Special:Contributions/146.127.253.14|146.127.253.14]]
: Ha, you have described a large percentage of D&D players.

Should we consider asking Pokey if he wants to convert Gil into the version of Barbarian in the Tome? It's quite an improvement on the class, trading passive DR and avoidance abilities for massive bonuses that only apply while raging, giving a lot more reason to actually use the ability. -[[User:Slitherrr|Slitherrr]]
:Pete might be similarly interested in the Elementalist class, although that might be more of a retcon than you're willing to go for. -[[User:Slitherrr|Slitherrr]]
::In fact, Kib's character style might even be better suited to the Tome's Fighter than our dear Professional class. Argh! So much dataaaa. -[[User:Slitherrr|Slitherrr]]
:::Feats section! ::eyes glaze over, froth appears at corner of mouth:: -[[User:Slitherrr|Slitherrr]]
:::: We are no longer on the same page. We are not even in the same book. There will be no revisions to any of the core mechanics of 3.5e. In fact, I basically skipped everything that was an actual rules mechanic. Heh. -gm
::::: I... guessed as much. But I can dream. Their treatment of feats is really quite spectacular, and I love what they did with armor (more than chain shirt/mw breastplate/full plate is useful? Holy Alexandria!) -[[User:Slitherrr|Slitherrr]]
:::::: Also, still interested in the tweak to Professions? Because that just downright makes sense.
::::::: I find the professional changes interesting, and I agree it's a lot more sensible. Does it also apply to crafting? I can't remember and i'm afraid to go back in. -gm
:::::::: I thought I'd posted this earlier, but I guess I didn't pull the trigger before leaving to see the Nutcracker. Crafting has some changes, some in the Traps section, and a lot in the Magic Items section to make it more reasonable. -[[User:Slitherrr|Slitherrr]]
::::::::: More clarification: Magic Items get a pretty big rework for balance. XP and gold costs to make are gone, by the argument that they don't really work as limits, and instead magic items only take time (which, really, is one of the only really valuable commodities PCs have). Also, gone is the "+2 sword" thing. Basically, it'll be a "magic sword", and the bonus you get from it scales by level. There's a strict limit on number of items that can be providing a bonus to a character at a given time, and another strict limit on non-standard bonus types (to prevent stacking). Artifacts have inherent levels that replace the character level to determine effects if the character level is lower--for example, the [[Black Scythe]] might have an inherent level of 15, which means a level 4 or 7 or 14 character would wield it with bonuses as a level 15, but a level 16 or more character would wield it with bonuses of 16 or more. It's very, very reasonable and sensible, and might even be worth switching to, since neither group has even really gotten into the magic items gig and there would be very little disruption. -[[User:Slitherrr|Slitherrr]]
:::::: Also also, I love this quote:

''<blockquote>Empires lasting thousands of years are not products of military might, but a good PR department with an eye for finding up-and-coming heroes who are smart enough to maintain the fiction of a stable society rather than upset the peasants by reminding them that they live and die by the whims of guys who think that summoning angels from heaven to set off dungeon traps is an acceptable practice.</blockquote>''
:::::: -[[User:Slitherrr|Slitherrr]]
::::::: Haha, yeah, I remember that one. I wish the real source books were written so cheekily. -gm

There's a Leadership section in the Tome that has a statement that talks about a thing I had just asked about:
''<blockquote>In any case, if Leadership is allowed at all, there are some ground rules. First of all, no Cohort should ever be more or less than 2 levels lower than the PC. Ever. So if someone has a cohort that’s something dumb like an Iron Golem, it's got to advance so that its CR advances in line with the character's level. Cohorts that can't be excused doing that aren’t appropriate cohorts. Secondly, followers are traditionally of the crappy classes (Warrior, Expert, Aristocrat), and that’s why followers are given appropriate CRs like 1=2 rather than levels like "1".</blockquote>''
Just tossing that here for reflection. -[[User:Slitherrr|Slitherrr]]

{| class="collapsible collapsed wikitable"
|-
! Old stuff, hidden 09:08, 30 November 2010 (EST)
|-
|

Man, you guys need to hurry up and get to, like, 14th level. -gm

I have forgotten how to edit the side menu, if anyone could remind me, I'd appreciate it. I'd like to add some things to getting started : Feats, for starters. Accepting suggestions for other things to add/remove. -gm

:[[MediaWiki:Sidebar]] -[[User:Slitherrr|Slitherrr]] 15:17, 1 December 2009 (EST)
:Also, maybe stick the reference stuff on the main page up there for easy access. -[[User:Slitherrr|Slitherrr]] 15:01, 2 December 2009 (EST)
:: Well, that's kind of a discussion I was hoping to spur - what sort of ref material, internal or external, is good to bring together? -gm
::: I specifically meant the "Useful Stuff" header--"Combat Reference" being what I was thinking of when I said "Reference Material". Other than that, I dunno. Maybe achievements? -[[User:Slitherrr|Slitherrr]] 22:12, 2 December 2009 (EST)

I'm about to have a looooooong stretch of sitting on my ass, which is normally a good time for new content 'round here. Any suggestions or ideas about what to focus on? -gm
: Pfft. I know you... you're too much like me. You're just going to spend a month playing PS3 and taking pills again ;)
: First things first: add to the sidebar! -[[User:Slitherrr|Slitherrr]] 12:23, 11 December 2009 (EST)
:: I can put that on the list, sure! -gm

I actually know RCBs name and class, but I'll let him make his own introductions. 6-8 months of gaming and finally an injection of new blood. I look forward to finally having some acrimony and arguments! ;) -gm
: I guessed you knew, I just put it that way so it would fit the format. -[[User:Slitherrr|Slitherrr]]
: Honestly, its horrifying how quickly MeFight progresses. They must be sick with agreement. Disgusting. --[[User:Msallen|Msallen]]
:: Maybe your group just needs a strong father figure to sort itself out. -[[User:Slitherrr|Slitherrr]]
::: Yeah, they're more like Party of Five. -gm
::: We already have 2 or 3... I can't imagine more would help. After 10-15 years playing together, we've learned that the dysFUNctional party is the most fun! --[[User:Msallen|Msallen]]
:::: For certain values of "fun." You'll take the MeFighter's out of my cold, dead hands! Or, to be fair, out of their own dead hands, since they're Risk Analysis Metrics are all fucked up. -gm
::::: Dude, how did you just kill your OWN edit? -[[User:Slitherrr|Slitherrr]]
::::: Also, our risk analysis isn't so bad. The poor guardsdwarves who attacked Swingin' Dan and the Professor probably don't think so, I suppose, but we still handled that fight pretty well despite that. -[[User:Slitherrr|Slitherrr]]
:::::: How many times has Thed or Thoven have wandered off alone and only survived due to a single lucky die roll. -gm
::::::: Yeeeah, they kind of have that habit. -[[User:Slitherrr|Slitherrr]]
:::::::: And there was maybe that time the ranger decided to go bow to bow with the +2 ranger... thankfully I was in a tree and it was a two-weapon ranger else I might not have had that 1 hp that I met the group with. :-P -[[User:Feantari|Feantari]]
::::::::: Well, FWIW, unless you got killed falling out of the tree, you probably would not have been killed and just would have met the party a different way. ;) -gm
|}

Talk:Notes for Game 2010-08-14

2010-08-16T20:03:07Z

146.127.253.44: New page: Wow, I missed a fuck-ton of XP! --~~~

Wow, I missed a fuck-ton of XP! --[[User:146.127.253.44|146.127.253.44]]

Talk:Flame Disciple

2010-07-16T12:34:02Z

146.127.253.44: /* Numbers */

I've not been playing for a particularly long time, so I have no idea how well (or poorly) balanced this is. Specifically, I'm not sure if the minor elemental storm is actually useful or if it's just cool sounding. I've also thought about spell-like abilities like the following that could be used in place of the ones listed or possibly in the 2nd and 4th level slots:

Wildfire: all creatures (enemies?) currently on fire explode, dealing some nominal damage to themselves and catching enemies within 10' on fire (chance to save by reflex).

Living bomb: small damage per round, larger AoE on death/expiration of the DoT/dispel.

Combustion(?): Causes a small explosion under the caster's feet, dealing some small amount of damage and knocking everyone within 5' backwards 10' (used to disengage from melee enemies), possibly a chance to knock the opponent prone?

Engulfing flames: Some sort of stacking effect where each fire damage by the caster causes the target to be more susceptible to fire for N rounds.

...

If more balance is needed, I think it would be appropriate for non-fire based offensive spells to count as one level higher than they are listed for purposes of spells known / per day.

Another option I've considered would be to flesh out all of the spells so far and provide them as a supplemental spell list that the caster could take as necessary.

Thoughts? Suggestions? Be gentle.

[[User:TooMuchPete|TooMuchPete]] 17:27, 21 June 2010 (EDT)

----

I'm sure Matt or Slitherrr will chime in on the numbers and rulesy stuff, they're good with that. I like the idea, overall, and think we can do some more interesting stuff with it. First off, as far as becoming half elemental, we can do that. To whit: <a href="http://www.crystalkeep.com/d20/rules/DnD3.5Index-Templates.pdf">Templates</a>. I'm not sure about the half-elemental in there, but other ones abound, might even have one in a dragon somewhere. Essentally you'd become an Fire Outsider instead of a Humanoid and some other fire related bonuses. I'll put some thought in and see what other kind of suggestions pop up. I think, probably, some of these might be underpowered or impractical (2 minute activation time! That's 20 rounds. The ENTIRE of last sundays game was like 15), and a couple need to be scaled back or gradated or even degradated. I like the idea of taking extra damage from cold, but I don't know that it needs to scale that much. 50% extra at third and double at 5th or something, since working in halves is kind of a mechanical normalcy.

Also: If it's going to have one good save, it's will. It's a good start, should be fun to work on -gm
:Ditto on will save, but the elemental swarm ability is pulled almost verbatim from the [http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/elementalswarm.htm SRD], so I think its point is to be cast outside of battle. I also agree with the 1/3/5 resist/vulnerability step, for the same reasons, although numbers will take tweaking. Something like 10/20/immune-x1/x1.5/x2 would probably work, although vulnerability in the SRD is only a +50%, so inspecting those numbers might be worthwhile. Perhaps +1d4/+1d8/vulnerability (+50%)? We'll have to look into some cold-damage spells and see what numbers they do to figure those out. Talking in IRC, Pete and I both think that 1d4 is probably too much self-damage per round for self-immolate. Obviously the damage can't be resistible, or it might as well not be there, but having a cost is important, too. It might be best to just make the ability a pure toggle--that would make the self-damage less scary, but allow it to still be the fairly large (for a sorc's hp) 1d4/round amount. -[[User:Slitherrr|Slitherrr]]
: Excellent thought. Let me bring a DM's eye to this - the less die the better. I would suggest something more along the lines of sacrificing X HP in order to generate some factor of Xd4 in damage, with a cap influenced by level. It makes the math very easy, and scales with level, which I think is an important aspect of prestige classes. I almost always include at least one scaling ability per package.
:: I think for GENERAL energy resistance, 1/3/5 is the way to go, but for a discrete damage type - especially coupled with a vulnerability - I think 5/10/15 or even 5/10/20 is appropriate. 20 isn't IMMUNE, but you could still probably play at least one game of ping pong while standing in a wall of fire.
::: This is hard to balance. Those are pretty small numbers when you start talking about the sorts of damage fire can do, ESPECIALLY if coupled with vulnerability. I say that, if the resistance numbers are this "small" (and it's pretty small, since fire spells really start racking up the damage at higher levels, and it's not like this resist can stack with Resist Energy casts), we should consider also really reducing the cold vulnerability, or removing it altogether. After all, elementals aren't vulnerable to opposite-aligned elemental spells, the vulnerability was just to balance the fairly powerful (on a PC) immunity, and possibly other abilities.
:::: Yeah, balance tweaking is in order here, but I don't think something like 5xDisciple Level in Flame DR is bad. 25 is quite a lot of resistance. The spells it won't soak up most of are things like delayed blast, which you don't need to be shrugging off, regardless. For any of the spells involved in the self-center mechanic, it should be more than enough - especially if that DR is doubled for that specific purpose.
:::: Oh, and elementals most certainly DO have vulnerabilities to opposite alignment. It's right there under "Special Qualities." Of course, it's not scaling, it's just Some creatures have vulnerability to a certain kind of energy effect (typically either cold or fire). Such a creature takes half again as much (+50%) damage as normal from the effect, regardless of whether a saving throw is allowed, or if the save is a success or failure. . I do like this idea, but perhaps as part of the level 5 "turning into a half elemental" package. -gm
::::: Holy fuck, how did I miss the vulnerability every single time I looked at that page, and the qualities section on same? Damn, man. But yeah, the vulnerability comes along with immunity, so 25 DR with 2.0x puts him at a severe disadvantage by comparison. I dunno, needz tweakz, but that's probably a secondary concern right now anyway.-[[User:Slitherrr|Slitherrr]]

::It feels somewhat weird to go from 1d8 to +50%, as it's not difficult to imagine a situation in which +8 would be more than 50% of the incoming damage. +25% might be awkward to do at level 3, and x2.0 might be a little high, but I think the x2 could be balanced a bit by adding another ability or somehow improving the survivability a bit in some other way. --[[User:TooMuchPete|TooMuchPete]] 11:15, 22 June 2010 (EDT)
: I'd prefer not to add extra dice in the singular, so for something like cold vulnerability, the more likely way to go is a penalty to save coupled with some straight % of damage increase.

:Also, the extent of transformation into an Elemental type would matter, since there are attributes that apply.

From the SRD:
# Darkvision out to 60 feet.
# Immunity to poison, sleep effects, paralysis, and stunning.
# Not subject to critical hits or flanking.
# Unlike most other living creatures, an elemental does not have a dual nature—its soul and body form one unit. When an elemental is slain, no soul is set loose. Spells that restore souls to their bodies, such as raise dead, reincarnate, and resurrection, don’t work on an elemental. It takes a different magical effect, such as limited wish, wish, miracle, or true resurrection, to restore it to life.
# Proficient with natural weapons only, unless generally humanoid in form, in which case proficient with all simple weapons and any weapons mentioned in its entry.
# Proficient with whatever type of armor (light, medium, or heavy) that it is described as wearing, as well as all lighter types. Elementals not indicated as wearing armor are not proficient with armor. Elementals are proficient with shields if they are proficient with any form of armor.
# Elementals do not eat, sleep, or breathe.

5 and 6 obviously don't apply, and 3 and 4 probably don't, since crits/flanking is based on not having a discernible front or anatomy, and the usual trope for 4 is for members of transformation PrCs to still count as their base type for purposes of resurrection (not that it matters in THIS particular campaign), but the rest are fair game. The dragon disciple even gains stats, but I think that the spells and extraordinary abilities offset that particular bit for this guy. -[[User:Slitherrr|Slitherrr]]

:: Yeah. I think a full on elemental type would me a little much. There are two or three different half-elemental templates floating around out there, to say nothing of a character race set (the Gensai, et al) based around half elementalism. The 5th level of the prestige class could be the acquisition of the template, which I think is preferable to a wholesale race substitution. But, either way, I think Outsider (Fire) getting added is a given considering the description.
::: Right. PrCs of this sort generally add a creature type, rather than substituting one completely (so Humanoid/Fire Elemental, or Humanoid/Outsider(Fire), which is a difference in degree), generally meaning that effects that target one or the other will affect the character (with some exceptions made, like being able to be resurrected and whatnot). -[[User:Slitherrr|Slitherrr]]

Most of the additional ideas above seem impractical or not terribly useful, but I'd like to find a way to work Wildfire in. The two big problems I see with it now are: a) It would need to use a spell slot. Maybe level 1 or 2? Otherwise I could imagine it being a bit over-powered. b) there aren't a ton of spells that actually set the enemy on fire, so there's not a ton of usefulness to it. The only solution I could see to that is that fire damage dealt could have a chance to set the target on fire (maybe coupled with self-immolate?). That might be more useful than the Minor Elemental Swarm, which I added just because sounds cool. --[[User:TooMuchPete|TooMuchPete]] 11:15, 22 June 2010 (EDT)
:Well, if it uses a spell slot, you might be better off just adding a fire-only spell slot to the class at the levels where he gains caster level, and then fleshing Wildfire out into a spell. Extraordinary/supernatural abilities tend to be limited by the x/day thing, or by repercussions (i.e. self-damage), or not limited at all.-[[User:Slitherrr|Slitherrr]]
:: s/Wildfire/Self-immolate. Damn your WoW-centric vocabulary! -[[User:Slitherrr|Slitherrr]]
::: Alright, I like the idea of where you're going with this, but I think that the stuff gained by the class needs to not be a spell like ability, but rather things that augment your spells. Consider, perhaps, the ability to cast any fire spell as a 10' radius (it could grow with character levels) spell centered on yourself. Either a set number of times per day, perhaps based on an attribute, or as a metamagic feat with sometihng like +1 spell level. You'd damage yourself, getting the immolation idea in, but the elemental resistance would eat up a lot of that. If the math works out to be too punishing, we could have the innate DR double when using the ability (so 5/10/20 or 30 becomes 10/20/40 or 60). So, for example, you could cast Burning Hands as a radius effect spell on yourself and you'd take whatever damage your fire resistance did not eat up, or a Searing Ray, or a Fireball or whatever.
::: Better, even, if the DR scales something like 5 per level, maxing out at 25 at level five? Likewise, perhaps, the character level would restrict the spell level for the ability: first level could only cast first level spells that way, through 5th level. Anything higher than that, really, even with 40 or 60 DR you might kill yourself.

::: As for Elemental Swarm - I think, especially considering you're going for the Pseudodragon, you would be better of developing it as a spell that you can pick up at the appropriate level. Something like what you are looking for, in spell form, probably exists in the wild

Thoughts? -gm
: For the record, I see that there are two options as far as the immolation thing goes - the metamagic feat or extraordinary ability that turns spells into radius effects or a scaling X nonpreventable damage for Yd4 effect. I prefer the former, because it has built in scaling (by picking the spell) and mimics in mechanics what I think you are going for (centering firestorms on yourself.)
: As for the firestorm idea, another option would be to include a metamagic feat that allows you to learn any elemntal tag spell as a fire version of that spell. So, cone of cold becomes cone of fire, etc. This way, there are actually a couple of options for firestorms at various levels, allowing you to get one or both. Ice Storm, which also impairs movement, and Acid Raid (or some such) which just does a megafuck damage. I think this is preferable, again, because it keeps the primary engine of your damage as the spell slot.
::I think we might be combing two different ideas here that I had not intended to be related. The tl;dr on self-immolation (as I've proposed it) is a damage buff to fire-spells that costs HP. The small, caster-centered AOE is more of a result of the way the ability was conceived... which is basically that the caster becomes engulfed in raging flames, doing damage to himself and surroundings, but making his fire spells more powerful. Wildfire is more of a way to make fire contagious. When the ability is used, enemies who are on fire have a chance to set nearby enemies on fire, too. [[User:TooMuchPete|TooMuchPete]] 11:07, 23 June 2010 (EDT)

----

I updated the article to reflect something of a consensus on the way to do fire resist (FR 5x Disciple Level), although I'm still not sure the best way to handle cold damage. In Elementals, Immunity to fire yields +50% cold damage, so anything that big seems like it would be bad news. One suggestion from [[slitherrr] was +1 to each cold damage die rolled, which is significant at high levels without being absurd. That would make sense to take effect on the 5th level. If something was needed in the interim, +1 per 2 dice could be done at level 3 or something.

I moved caster level advancement from levels 1,3,5 to levels 2,4 to provide a bit of room to do more fun stuff.

I also removed Minor Elemental Swarm -- the idea is neat, but it seems impractical and like it would be rarely used for it to be a 5th level ability.

Some ideas so far for filling in other abilities (etc):
* Metamagic feats don't cost anything for fire-based spells
* Possibly the option between two different styles of new metamagic feat:
** Fire spells all get a knockback/knockdown, or
** Fire spells apply a damage over time effect
* A caster-centered explosion (presumably to deal with being swarmed)
* The ability to learn druid/cleric/etc fire spells at some sort of level penalty

I'm open to suggestions for others, it seems (at least to me) like there's a bit of room to push more cool stuff in without making the class over-powered.

-[[User:TooMuchPete|TooMuchPete]] 17:07, 23 June 2010 (EDT)

-------
Alright, this is what i've come up with. Saving throws are blanked, but I expect Will is strong, and Fort and Ref are weak. I'm willing to hear arguments to the contrary, naturally, but that's my initial inclination. d8 HD is clearly far too much, but considering the HP sacrificing mechanic and the severely reduced caster progression, d6 is very reasonable. I ditched the "becoming a half elemental" idea - sort of - instead migrating that ability to the familiar to give some kind of ability gain on the even (caster increase) levels. Increased the spell prereqs to bring in line with other specialist prestige classes. Persistent damage is something I try to avoid for sanity sake, but liked having a offensive defense ability and tried to compensate with a more potent single round of damage. Finally, added a mechanic that *might* be a tad to complicated (but I don't think so) in order to create a "fire storm" sort of mechanic that is still tied to spell slots rather than special abilities.

Input encouraged.

{{draft}}

'''Description:''' In Flux

'''Prerequisites:''' the ability to cast four arcane spells with the fire descriptor, one of which must be at least 3rd-level or greater offensive Fire spell. 7 ranks of Spellcraft, 5 ranks of Knowledge(Arcana), and 3 ranks of Knowledge(The Planes). Must not have an elemental creature type (wholly or partially).

'''Hit Dice: d6'''

'''Skill Points:''' 2+INT

'''Class Skills:''' Spot, Listen, Concentration, Knowledge (Arcana), Knowledge (The Planes), Spellcraft

{| class="wikitable" style="text-align:center"
|+
|-
! × Level !! Natural AC Bonus !! BaB !! Fort !! Ref !! Will !! Ability
|-
! 1
| +0 || +1 || +0 || +0 || +0 || ''Soul Furnace'', ''Flame Resistance'', ''Fire Mastery'' ||
|-
! 2
| +1 || +1 || +0 || +0 || +0 || ''Resistant Familiar'', +1 to arcane caster level for spell progression ||
|-
! 3
| +1 || +2 || +0 || +0 || +0 || ''Burning Blood'', ''Inner Fire''||
|-
! 4
| +2 || +2 || +0 || +0 || +0 || ''Elemental Familiar'', +1 to arcane caster level for spell progression ||
|-
! 5
| +2 || +3 || +0 || +0 || +0 || ''Lingering Flames''||
|}

''Fire Mastery'' - All spells with the fire descriptor cast do additional fire damage equal to caster's Flame Disciple level.

''Fire Resistance'' - Flame Disciples develop flame resistance equal to 5x their Disciple level. This does not stack with fire resistance from other sources.

''Inner Fire'' - The caster's soul furnace has reached such intensity that he or she may ignite flammable materials with nothing but a touch. If the item is in someone's possession or equipped my someone, then they are entitled to a reflex save to avoid the effect. If the item is magical, it is entitled to a save to avoid the effect. In both cases, the save is DC 10 + Flame Disciple Level + Caster Attribute Mod.

''Resistant Familiar'' - If the caster has a familiar, that familiar shares the caster's innate fire resistance if within 30 feet.

''Soul Furnace (Sp)'' - For fire-based spells, the caster may sacrifice some of his own life-force to empower them. The caster may sacrifice up to two hit points per spell level as a free action when casting a spell, adding 1d4 fire damage for each hit point so sacrificed. This effect is limited to spell levels less than or equal to the disciple level, and may only be used on spells with the fire descriptor.

''Elemental Familiar'' - If the caster has a familiar, that familiar gains the "Elemental (Fire)" template, Fire Immunity and Cold Vulnerability. In addition, the familiar gains a fire breath weapon, with 15' range, dealing 1d4 points of damage per caster attribute bonus. The DC for this breath weapon is 15.

''Burning Blood (Sp)'' - The caster's blood burns as hot as fire when exposed to oxygen. When struck in melee combat by an adjacent foe, the attacker must make a reflex save (DC 10+Disciple level+Caster Attribute Bonus) or take 1d4 points of damage per disciple level.

''Lingering Flames (Metamagic)'' - The caster becomes so in tune with fire type spells that he or she gains the ability to increase the duration of instantaneous spells. If the caster takes a full round action to cast a fire spell, its duration may be changed from "instantaneous" to any number of rounds of the caster's choosing. For every round the spell is extended, the spell's effective level is increased by one. If Soul Furnace is used in conjunction with this ability, the increased damage must be paid for *each round* the caster wishes to have increased damage.

Example: A Burning Hands spell cast as a third level spell would burn from the casters fingertips for three rounds: The instantaneous duration, plus one round for each spell level. Any creature in the area of effect during the caster's turn, or entering into the area of effect on its own turn, takes the damage. (Much like Ice Storm of Fire Storm spells). Likewise, a fireball cast as a fourth level spell would do exist for the round of casting plus one round.

[[Category:Prestige Classes]]

----

Just to note, here, vulnerability is huuuuge, especially with caster HP. Elementals get away with it because they have tons of d8 HD, and resist tons of other forms of damage, but the poor flame disciple is going to find himself completely down and out even on a successful reflex save and with a decent amount of cold resistance with a single cone of cold, or similar attack. I don't know if any of his other abilities really give him enough damage output to justify that sort of vulnerability, especially if he's losing immunity. -[[User:Slitherrr|Slitherrr]]

I like the quality where there is fire everywhere with this guy. I kind of like the nova more than the burning blood ability, although the fact that the blood is a reaction that doesn't take an action probably makes it better. --[[User:146.127.253.12|146.127.253.12]]

==Numbers==
Whipped up an app to generate numbers. Here are damage numbers for all the cold spells in the SRD.

CLvl is caster level, min max and average are for that level, boost are the same but with vulnerability, avgbr## is avgboost with resist of that amount applied before vulnerability.

It's probably worth pointing out that the min level is based on Wizard caster level. Sorcs will be higher. I also didn't check whether any of them were domain spells that might occur at an earlier level. This also, I just remembered, doesn't include Divine spells--I can add them pretty easily, once I get back to the computer that has the script. -[[User:Slitherrr|Slitherrr]]
:Never mind, there are no cold-damage Divine spells. -[[User:Slitherrr|Slitherrr]]
::One cold-damage Druid spell (kept here to remember later): [http://www.d20srd.org/srd/spells/chillMetal.htm Chill Metal]

<pre>

Ray of Frost, min caster level 1, Cold Type, Ranged touch attack
CLvl| min| max| avg|minboost|maxboost|avgboost|avgbr10|avgbr20|avgbr30
1| 1| 3| 2.0| 1.5| 4.5| 3.0| 0.0| 0.0| 0.0

Cold Shield, min caster level 7, Cold Type, No save
CLvl| min| max| avg|minboost|maxboost|avgboost|avgbr10|avgbr20|avgbr30
7| 8| 13| 10.0| 12.0| 19.5| 15.0| 0.0| 0.0| 0.0
8| 9| 14| 11.0| 13.5| 21.0| 16.5| 1.5| 0.0| 0.0
9| 10| 15| 12.0| 15.0| 22.5| 18.0| 3.0| 0.0| 0.0
10| 11| 16| 13.0| 16.5| 24.0| 19.5| 4.5| 0.0| 0.0
11| 12| 17| 14.0| 18.0| 25.5| 21.0| 6.0| 0.0| 0.0
12| 13| 18| 15.0| 19.5| 27.0| 22.5| 7.5| 0.0| 0.0
13| 14| 19| 16.0| 21.0| 28.5| 24.0| 9.0| 0.0| 0.0
14| 15| 20| 17.0| 22.5| 30.0| 25.5| 10.5| 0.0| 0.0
15| 16| 21| 18.0| 24.0| 31.5| 27.0| 12.0| 0.0| 0.0

Ice Storm, min caster level 7, Cold Type, No save
CLvl| min| max| avg|minboost|maxboost|avgboost|avgbr10|avgbr20|avgbr30
7| 2| 12| 6.0| 3.0| 18.0| 9.0| 0.0| 0.0| 0.0

Wall of Ice, min caster level 7, Cold Type, No save
CLvl| min| max| avg|minboost|maxboost|avgboost|avgbr10|avgbr20|avgbr30
7| 8| 13| 10.0| 12.0| 19.5| 15.0| 0.0| 0.0| 0.0
8| 9| 14| 11.0| 13.5| 21.0| 16.5| 1.5| 0.0| 0.0
9| 10| 15| 12.0| 15.0| 22.5| 18.0| 3.0| 0.0| 0.0
10| 11| 16| 13.0| 16.5| 24.0| 19.5| 4.5| 0.0| 0.0
11| 12| 17| 14.0| 18.0| 25.5| 21.0| 6.0| 0.0| 0.0
12| 13| 18| 15.0| 19.5| 27.0| 22.5| 7.5| 0.0| 0.0
13| 14| 19| 16.0| 21.0| 28.5| 24.0| 9.0| 0.0| 0.0
14| 15| 20| 17.0| 22.5| 30.0| 25.5| 10.5| 0.0| 0.0
15| 16| 21| 18.0| 24.0| 31.5| 27.0| 12.0| 0.0| 0.0
16| 17| 22| 19.0| 25.5| 33.0| 28.5| 13.5| 0.0| 0.0
17| 18| 23| 20.0| 27.0| 34.5| 30.0| 15.0| 0.0| 0.0
18| 19| 24| 21.0| 28.5| 36.0| 31.5| 16.5| 1.5| 0.0
19| 20| 25| 22.0| 30.0| 37.5| 33.0| 18.0| 3.0| 0.0
20| 21| 26| 23.0| 31.5| 39.0| 34.5| 19.5| 4.5| 0.0

Cone of Cold, min caster level 9, Cold Type, Save for half
CLvl| min| max| avg|minboost|maxboost|avgboost|avgbr10|avgbr20|avgbr30
9| 9| 54| 31.0| 13.5| 81.0| 46.5| 31.5| 16.5| 1.5
10| 10| 60| 35.0| 15.0| 90.0| 52.5| 37.5| 22.5| 7.5
11| 11| 66| 38.0| 16.5| 99.0| 57.0| 42.0| 27.0| 12.0
12| 12| 72| 42.0| 18.0| 108.0| 63.0| 48.0| 33.0| 18.0
13| 13| 78| 45.0| 19.5| 117.0| 67.5| 52.5| 37.5| 22.5
14| 14| 84| 49.0| 21.0| 126.0| 73.5| 58.5| 43.5| 28.5
15| 15| 90| 52.0| 22.5| 135.0| 78.0| 63.0| 48.0| 33.0

Freezing Sphere, min caster level 11, Cold Type, Save for half
CLvl| min| max| avg|minboost|maxboost|avgboost|avgbr10|avgbr20|avgbr30
11| 11| 66| 38.0| 16.5| 99.0| 57.0| 42.0| 27.0| 12.0
12| 12| 72| 42.0| 18.0| 108.0| 63.0| 48.0| 33.0| 18.0
13| 13| 78| 45.0| 19.5| 117.0| 67.5| 52.5| 37.5| 22.5
14| 14| 84| 49.0| 21.0| 126.0| 73.5| 58.5| 43.5| 28.5
15| 15| 90| 52.0| 22.5| 135.0| 78.0| 63.0| 48.0| 33.0

Polar Ray, min caster level 15, Cold Type, Ranged touch attack
CLvl| min| max| avg|minboost|maxboost|avgboost|avgbr10|avgbr20|avgbr30
15| 15| 90| 52.0| 22.5| 135.0| 78.0| 63.0| 48.0| 33.0
16| 16| 96| 56.0| 24.0| 144.0| 84.0| 69.0| 54.0| 39.0
17| 17| 102| 59.0| 25.5| 153.0| 88.5| 73.5| 58.5| 43.5
18| 18| 108| 63.0| 27.0| 162.0| 94.5| 79.5| 64.5| 49.5
19| 19| 114| 66.0| 28.5| 171.0| 99.0| 84.0| 69.0| 54.0
20| 20| 120| 70.0| 30.0| 180.0| 105.0| 90.0| 75.0| 60.0
21| 21| 126| 73.0| 31.5| 189.0| 109.5| 94.5| 79.5| 64.5
22| 22| 132| 77.0| 33.0| 198.0| 115.5| 100.5| 85.5| 70.5
23| 23| 138| 80.0| 34.5| 207.0| 120.0| 105.0| 90.0| 75.0
24| 24| 144| 84.0| 36.0| 216.0| 126.0| 111.0| 96.0| 81.0
25| 25| 150| 87.0| 37.5| 225.0| 130.5| 115.5| 100.5| 85.5

</pre>

Am I reading this table right? I get the impression that vulnerability will increase the damage of cold based spells by between 80% and 150% depending on the spell. Double damage from spells does seem pretty rough. --[[User:146.127.253.44|146.127.253.44]]

User talk:Slitherrr

2010-05-24T23:00:04Z

146.127.253.44:

The consensus is that this dude is 20% crazy, 78% awesome, and 2% mechanically separated chicken. --[[User:Msallen|Msallen]] 16:08, 19 September 2009 (EDT)

:I also contain trace amounts of lemon scent. -[[User:Slitherrr|Slitherrr]] 00:33, 20 September 2009 (EDT)

Uhhhh. Wha? -gm
:Storing screen shots as I progress through vvvvvv (at [http://www.distractionware.com/ the site]). I want to beat it on no death mode! I've gotten it down to 310 deaths so far... -[[User:66.207.91.56|66.207.91.56]]
:: hahaha, glad to be of service. good luck

FYI: GM doesn't give a shit about level/power balance between players. --[[User:Msallen|Msallen]]
:: I give a shit. I just don't give TWO shits. --[[User:Detarame|absalom]] 16:15, 24 May 2010 (EDT)
:Good to know. I guess the big question is whether he wants to deal with the cohort stuff while we're in the middle of a big dungeon crawl. -[[User:66.207.91.56|66.207.91.56]]
::: Spoiler Alert! (No, I don't.)--[[User:Detarame|absalom]] 16:15, 24 May 2010 (EDT)
:: Probably will just show up when you get to a convenient place. I doubt I'll be getting a cohort before level 8! --[[User:Msallen|Msallen]]
::: Yours is actually surprisingly tricky/annoying to come up with. I have a couple of people in mind, but there are no really organic matches as of yet. --[[User:Detarame|absalom]] 16:15, 24 May 2010 (EDT)
:::: Yeah, I agree. There isn't anyone who fits in naturally. I think we talked about this, but maybe it was in my imagination. In case I didn't, I don't care if the cohort doesn't show up for a couple of levels. Seems like some story needs to be laid for that. I took the feat early more for the RP element than anything. Frankly, since I would prefer *not* to get a combat-focused bodyguard (or at least one outside of the skill-heavy ranger/bard/rogue/professional world), its really only to improve my information gathering skills so it just doesn't feel that necessary. --[[User:146.127.253.44|146.127.253.44]]

User talk:Slitherrr

2010-05-24T14:37:56Z

146.127.253.44:

Talk:Germain's Character Sheet

2010-03-22T12:52:52Z

146.127.253.44:

RE: Hit points: With 12 con, MAX-1 for 8 HD is 8? -gm
: Isn't it MAX-2 for every level after 2? I can't ever remember your HP rules. Otherwise, ya. --[[User:Msallen|Msallen]]
:: First character level is max, all the rest are max -1.
:: (8+1 = 9),(8-1+1 = 8),(8-1+1 = 8),(8-1+1 = 8),(8-1+1 = 8) = 41 -[[User:Slitherrr|Slitherrr]]
::: I believe you have discovered a latent inequity! Original campaign started at level two, and so got max for first 2 levels, then max -1. MeFites started at level one, and so only got max for level 1. -gm
:::: Wow... we started a level ahead, and they still caught up to our two years of adventuring in 6 months! Wydmoor allstars FTL :( --[[User:146.127.253.44|146.127.253.44]]

Did you know in ancient times, big pilgrim cities would often be flush with "travelers guides" of various degrees of quality? You could have picked a few up, at nominal gold cost, to justify enough for a couple points in dadtim and/or alexandria's city. -gm
: Yeah, I was considering it. Points are tight trying to qualify for Dragoman at 7 and bring my wheelhouse skills up to max. I already dropped bluff from my wheelhouse to be able to get some extra points in knowledge skills :| I'll see what I can do. --[[User:Msallen|Msallen]]
:: My usual playbook fort that situation is to sacrifice my max skill to get the glass I'm looking for, then double down the next level to get back up to max.
::: I did that last level :| I doubled down on SM to bring it to max since I want it to be my main bag, and then I only put a point in my other max skills. I do think another knowledge: local is a good idea. --[[User:Msallen|Msallen]]

===Skills===
Do synergy bonuses stack? I was under the impression that they didn't. -[[User:Slitherrr|Slitherrr]] 12:09, 11 November 2009 (EST)

A little research suggests they don't as of 3.5. Booo. -[[User:Slitherrr|Slitherrr]] 12:10, 11 November 2009 (EST)

Actually, scratch that. It looks like it went from being a "synergy bonus" to an "unnamed bonus", so despite the vague wording of the synergy bit in the skill, it evidently does, indeed, stack. -[[User:Slitherrr|Slitherrr]] 12:13, 11 November 2009 (EST)

I am pretty sure they stack based only on the few character optimization posts I've read. Those nerds would have seen a rules violation from a mile away. That said, I think they shouldn't. Syn bonuses are definitely unbalanced and heavily abusable in 3.5, especially around diplomacy. I wouldn't abuse them like I have except that I self-identify as a munchkin and I feel no obligation to violate my lifestyle. -[[User:Msallen|Msallen]] 13:03, 11 November 2009 (EST)

: Diplomacy is impossible to unbalance because you can't talk your way out of a knife to the back. -gm

:: Only true if you completely disregard the "influence NPC reactions" table (which any good game master will do anyways). A real diplomancer would have at least +22 or so at my level, which would allow me to avoid all kinds of combat through talkin'. Also: [http://community.wizards.com/go/thread/view/75882/19861846/Campaign_Smashers_II_The_stuff_that_completely_breaks_the_game]. -[[User:Msallen|Msallen]] 14:03, 12 November 2009 (EST)

::: I *wish* I had that diplomancer in my group. He'd be dead in two sessions. I do not miss players like this, though I'm somewhat eager to encounter one again one day. Good luck out rules lawyering me in 3.5 : the Diplomancer concept has a fatal flaw that the player seems to willfully ignore. Namely : "Changing others’ attitudes with Diplomacy generally takes at least 1 full minute (10 consecutive full-round actions). In some situations, this time requirement may greatly increase." I suppose the counter would be to take a rushed one at -10, which I would patently disallow, because you can't do any meaningful diplomacy in six seconds. Since that would lead to some whinging and arguing, I'd give the "ok" and then move on to my next trick. After all, that's hardly the only fuckin' I could give. ". . . to influence the attitude of a nonplayer character, or wild empathy checks made to influence the attitude of an animal or magical beast."

Notice that article? It's consistantly singular. That is, even with a hurried diplomacy action every round, you'd still only get to turn ONE NPCs reaction per round, not that of a whole group. And, the instant Mr Diplomancer convinces that one guy to oppose his fellows, I'll give you one guess as to who the rest of the opposition will concentrate fire on. -gm

:Yeah, and what Jones is saying is basically what is flavoring the Professional discussion from my point of view, and what makes him so tough to balance. His power outside of combat stems a lot from talky-talky, and that power is so easy to cancel out that it's really hard to judge exactly how powerful it makes him. -[[User:Slitherrr|Slitherrr]]

Whats crappy about the sync bonuses is how quickly they push other characters out of the dipl game. In general, a player that wants to be top-notch at a specific skill for player reasons can be with minimal investment. However, if you don't go ape-shit with diplomacy getting all the support skills, its really hard to have much impact compared to a diplomancer type. --[[User:Msallen|Msallen]] 13:16, 14 January 2010 (EST)

You know, Germain really doesn't spend much time lying anymore--now that hes increasingly important, he just doesn't have to front as much. I'm considering focusing on Dipl, SM, and GI, and putting bluff/intimidate on the back burner. At +10, they are pretty strong, and I'm sure I'll be able to buy them up a little more (and benefit from the Dragoman feature). I might just leave him at "capable" liar and buy up some more knowledge skills. --[[User:Msallen|Msallen]]

===Leveling and Respec===
Ranger! Crazy talk! -[[User:Slitherrr|Slitherrr]]
: FAVORED ENEMY: HUMAN! --[[User:192.147.58.6|192.147.58.6]] 13:11, 14 January 2010 (EST)
Potential changes from Fighter -> Professional respec:
* HP -2
* Fort Save -1
* Remove: Evasion
* Add: Insightful Defense
* Skills: 6 pts (can't raise any skills past level 3 max)
** 1 listen
** 1 spot
** 2 search
** 2 intimidate

No changes occur to:
* Feats: lost fighter bonus, gained prof bonus--since I took skill feats with 2 human starting feats and
* BaB: Prof level 2->3 gets a +1 BaB

Done! In the process I realized I took 8 skills instead of 9 for my newest ranger level! --[[User:Msallen|Msallen]]

I guess there is a part of me that is looking at the [[Field Marshall]] and seriously considering it. --[[User:Msallen|Msallen]]
: Then go capture one. Kib has a reason to be able to access Sentinal and Field Marshall classes. I'm not sure Germain does. -gm

===Gear===
An unintended consequence of our changes is that my goofy earring, which gives skill bonuses or eagle's splendor, gets a little cooler at mid levels --[[User:Msallen|Msallen]]
: Hm?
: Also, what'd you think of that new feat?
:: Er. Because the clicky will give me an AC bonus starting at level 6. I like the feat in concept, although I'm not sure I'm capable of evaluating how useful it is. It might be too situational, but I don't have a good grip on that sort of thing. --[[User:Msallen|Msallen]]
::: Well, I didn't actually create the feat, I lifted it. I imagine the goal is to give an Aid Another to someone ELSE who is also going to AoO? Also, don't forget, your Eagle's Splendor only lasts 3 minutes and shuts off your +1 for 24 hours. ;)
:::: Um. Eagle's Splendor is Charisma, not Intelligence. It'll be a + to Will Saves if you take the feat, but that's it.-[[User:Slitherrr|Slitherrr]]
::::: Yeah, sorry, I assume what was meant was Fox's Cunning. LE's Charisma Cloak clickies to Eagle's Splendor. -gm
::::: Ah, I think Jones meant for it to be Fox's Cunning (int bonus) based on how he explained it: get +1 on int skills all the time, or get +2 for a short period. That said, if I was wrong, sweet! I'll take a charisma buff any day! --[[User:Msallen|Msallen]]
:::::: If you're done, why do you still have evasion?

===Leadership===
I still don't get why you'd grab leadership at lvl 5. Cohort always maxes out at Level-2. I always thought the +2 Improved Leadership was kind of a booby prize. -gm
: Yeah, I don't know if I will take it in the end. It depends on a lot of things:
:* Have I had an in-game justification to get a second knowledge (local) skill up to 6. If I can, I'll be picking up [[Dragoman]] at level 7. I'll probably take it to level 2--the +3 bonus to all charisma skills is hot for me, and I'd really like to get +2 and take-10 with Sense Motive. That'll mean I won't get leadership until level 9 if I don't take it as a feat.
:* Do I have an in-game justification to take leadership at 6? I might not even feel like the Germ has the contacts or resources to take leadership, and I'd like to have an NPC in mind for cohort potential. In all honesty, I'm probably also more interested in the followers than the cohorts, since I'm not even sure I'll take a combat-based cohort. For followers, the +2 bonus does have a noticeable effect.
:* What do you have in mind for the leadership feat? Its a weird feat with very little structure that is highly dependent on the GM, campaign, and player. So I'll just be talking to you a lot about it as I get closer to 6. If it it has a strong RP component that'll cause NPC organizations to put me in charge of lots of people, then I'll take it earlier. If I have to have my own base of operations, funding, and political capital to make full use of it, then I'll take it later. If it means I'm more likely to start building more permanent relationships with a higher level of loyalty with the NPCs I interact with, I'll take it earlier. Etc. etc.
:Hence the question mark. Its still pretty unresolved whether and how I'm going to use the feat. --[[User:Msallen|Msallen]]
:: Well, you've got, what, 2 more levels before it's an issue? I'll backburner it for now - 2010/1401 is going to be a VERY chaotic year for Wydmoor, so where Germ goes and how he develops is up in the air: all possibilities are on the table. That's all I can say about that right now. If you wanted a knowledge local, you could, perhaps, pick a city or region where one of the OTHER characters has some Knowledge Local skill points and learn from them. I mean, I'm a big fan of assuming the players are doing stuff like conversating and such during all the Walking Time characters do, so I've never bought fully into the "well, I didn't do anything in game to justify the expense." With months of skipped over downtime, there's plenty of time to practice skills and wotnot on the road. (Though, for something like your ranger level, the RP component becomes a lot more important.) -gm
::: Aight. I guess I was under the impression that you had to spend some time in an area to build up knowledge (local), but chatting, libraries, and reading newspapers is enough? I'll probably aim to build up my knowledge of ubrekt city, since I already have some points in it and its probably easy to get news/info about since its such an important city. Or I'll see what the other party members have. Still doesn't really resolve this issue since it'll just cause my to postpone prof 6 for 3 levels for sure. --[[User:Msallen|Msallen]]
===Languages===
Looks like I am short a language, since ubrekti and regional language are both granted to starting characters. What makes sense from a game perspective. Germ has been around Fresia/Flannery and Ubrekti City most of his life, so it seems like I could easily make a case for any of them? --[[User:Msallen|Msallen]]
: I thought you already had Flannary and Fresia? The regional language for Ubrekt is actually Hakni. -gm
:: Wouldn't I start with Ubrekti and Fresia? I was under the impression from the contentious language talk page that you start with common + regional + int bonus? --[[User:Msallen|Msallen]]
::: Well, either Ubrekti and Fresia, or Ubrekti and Flanneri. What I think that Matt is referring to, though, is that if you spent a lot of time in Ubrekti City, it'd make sense if you knew Hakni, since that's the actual regional language, there. -[[User:Slitherrr|Slitherrr]]
::: Also, for being the more worldly and less beefy incarnation of Kib, you sure haven't spent many points in Speak Language. -[[User:Slitherrr|Slitherrr]]
:::: The only other language we've had to deal with was Lizardmanlander! When will I ever use that again? Probably pick up Odessan soon since you people are invading my new town. --[[User:Msallen|Msallen]]
::::: Yeah, I have no idea why Odessan is so widely spoken in the MFC group, since most of them are Gildenhomers. WEIRD. -[[User:Slitherrr|Slitherrr]]
:::::: Is it really that widely spoken? I see Thed being the only one having it that doesn't have a super obvious reason to... -[[User:Feantari|Feantari]]
::::::: You're right, for some reason I was remembering Thoven as having it. -[[User:Slitherrr|Slitherrr]]

Germain's Character Sheet

2010-03-22T12:51:13Z

146.127.253.44: /* Secondary */

==Attributes==

===Primary===
{|
|Strength||  ||10
|-
|Dexterity||  ||12
|-
|Constitution||  ||12
|-
|Intelligence||  ||14
|-
|Wisdom||  ||14
|-
|Charisma||  ||15
|}

===Secondary===
{|
|Hit Points||  ||42||  ||9 + 9 + 8 + 8 + 8
|-
|Armor Class||||18||||+3 studded leather, +3 dex bonus (+2 to Dex bonus from insightful defense), +2 [[Barbarian King's Buckler|shield]]
|-
|Armor Class||||20||||+5 chain mail, +3 dex bonus (+2 to Dex bonus from insightful defense), +2 [[Barbarian King's Buckler|shield]]
|-
|Base Attack Bonus||||+4||||
|-
|Initiative||||+1||||
|-
|Base Speed||||30 ft./20 ft.||||studded leather/chain mail
|-
|Fort Save||||+4||||+1 professional 4, +2 ranger 1, +1 stat
|-
|Reflex Save||||+7||||+4 professional 4, +2 ranger 1, +1 stat
|-
|Will Save||||+6||||+4 professional 4, +2 stat
|}

==Feats and Abilities==

===Purchased Feats===
*Combat Expertise
*Investigator (+2 search, +2 gather information)
*[[Knowledgeable]] (+1 all knowledge skills)
*Negotiator (+2 diplomacy, +2 sense motive)
*Persuader (+2 bluff, +2 intimidate)

===Class Feats===
*Favored Enemy: Human
*Insightful Defense
*Proficiency (Armor): Light, Medium
*Proficiency (Shield): Small, Large
*Proficiency (Weapon): Simple, Martial
*Track
*Uncanny Dodge
*Wild Empathy

===Languages===
*Dwarven
*Flannari
*Fresian
*Hakni
*Ubrekti

==Skills==
{|class=sortable
!Skill!!class=unsortable|  !!Bonus!!class=unsortable|  !!class=unsortable|Bonus Derivation
|-
|Bluff||||10||||6 ranks, +2 stat, +2 persuader
|-
|Diplomacy||||15||||7 ranks, +2 stat, +2 negotiator, +4 syn (bluff, sm)
|-
|Gather Info||||11||||7 ranks, +2 stat, +2 investigator
|-
|Handle Animal||||7||||5 ranks, +2 stat
|-
|Intimidate||||10||||4 ranks, +2 stat, +2 persuader, +2 syn (bluff)
|-
|Knowledge (Geography)||||6||||2 ranks, +2 stat, +1 knowledgeable, +1 [[Germain's_Character_Sheet#Absolutely_Fabulous_Earring_of_Competence|earring]]
|-
|Knowledge (History)||||6||||2 ranks, +2 stat, +1 knowledgeable, +1 [[Germain's_Character_Sheet#Absolutely_Fabulous_Earring_of_Competence|earring]]
|-
|Knowledge (Local, Alexandria City)||||6||||2 ranks, +2 stat, +1 knowledgeable, +1 [[Germain's_Character_Sheet#Absolutely_Fabulous_Earring_of_Competence|earring]]
|-
|Knowledge (Local, Home)||||8||||4 ranks, +2 stat, +1 knowledgeable, +1 [[Germain's_Character_Sheet#Absolutely_Fabulous_Earring_of_Competence|earring]]
|-
|Knowledge (Local, Ubrekt City)||||8||||4 ranks, +2 stat, +1 knowledgeable, +1 [[Germain's_Character_Sheet#Absolutely_Fabulous_Earring_of_Competence|earring]]
|-
|Knowledge (Local, Wydmoor Free City)||||10||||6 ranks, +2 stat, +1 knowledgeable, +1 [[Germain's_Character_Sheet#Absolutely_Fabulous_Earring_of_Competence|earring]]
|-
|Knowledge (Nature)||||6||||2 ranks, +2 stat, +1 knowledgeable, +1 [[Germain's_Character_Sheet#Absolutely_Fabulous_Earring_of_Competence|earring]]
|-
|Knowledge (Nobility)||||6||||2 ranks, +2 stat, +1 knowledgeable, +1 [[Germain's_Character_Sheet#Absolutely_Fabulous_Earring_of_Competence|earring]]
|-
|Knowledge (Religion)||||6||||2 ranks, +2 stat, +1 knowledgeable, +1 [[Germain's_Character_Sheet#Absolutely_Fabulous_Earring_of_Competence|earring]]
|-
|Listen||||8||||6 ranks, +2 stat
|-
|Ride||||6||||3 ranks, +2 syn (ha) +1 stat
|-
|Search||||9||||5 ranks, +2 stat, +2 investigator
|-
|Sense Motive||||12||||8 ranks, +2 stat, +2 negotiator
|-
|Spot||||8||||6 ranks, +2 stat
|-
|Survival||||4||||2 ranks, +2 stat
|}

==Notable Equipment==
===[[Barbarian King's Buckler]]===
* +1 buckler
* when first struck by a missile weapon in a round, you may make a DC 20 save to block the arrow
* any arrows passing within 10' the wielder are rerouted to him

===Absolutely Fabulous Earring of Competence===
* +1 to intelligence skill checks
* can be activated to cast Fox's Cunning, but skill bonus is lost for 24 hours

===Ring of Tweets===
* once per day, may send a 10 word message to [[Edrell Odenthorpe|Edrell]]
* invisible for 2 rounds, at-will, 2-day

==Advancement==
Starting Feats: Persuader, Combat Expertise

===Level 1: [[Professional]] 1===
*Bonus Feat: [[Knowledgeable]]
*4 Bluff
*4 Diplomacy
*4 Gather Info
*4 Knowledge (Local, Wydmoor)
*4 Knowledge (Local, Home)
*2 Knowledge (Local, Ubrekt City)
*2 Knowledge (Nobility)
*2 Knowledge (Religion)
*2 Knowledge (Geography)
*2 Knowledge (History)
*4 Listen
*2 Search
*4 Sense Motive
*4 Spot

===Level 2: [[Professional]] 2===
*1 Bluff
*1 Diplomacy
*1 Gather Info
*2 Intimidate
*1 Listen
*2 Ride
*1 Search
*1 Sense Motive
*1 Spot

===Level 3: [[Professional]] 3===
*Level Feat: Negotiator
*Bonus Feat: Investigator
*1 Bluff
*1 Diplomacy
*1 Gather Info
*1 Intimidate
*1 Knowledge (Local, Wydmoor)
*1 Listen
*1 Ride
*2 Search
*1 Sense Motive
*1 Spot

===Level 4: Ranger 1===
*Level Stat Bonus: Charisma
*Class Feature: Favored enemy: Human
*5 Handle Animal
*2 Knowledge (Nature)
*2 Survival

===Level 5: [[Professional]] 4===
*Class Feature: Uncanny Dodge
*Language: Dwarven
*1 Diplomacy
*1 Gather Info
*1 Intimidate
*2 Knowledge (Local, Alexandria City)
*2 Knowledge (Local, Ubrekt City)
*1 Knowledge (Local, Wydmoor)
*2 Sense Motive

==Notes for Future Levels==

===Level 6: [[Professional]] 5===
*Level Feat: Leadership?
*Bonus Feat: Skill Focus (Diplomacy)
*2 Diplomacy
*2 Gather Info
*2 Knowledge (Local, Other?)
*1 Sense Motive
*1 Listen?
*1 Search?
*1 Spot?
*1 Other?

===Level 7: [[Dragoman]] 1===
*Class Feature: Silver Tongue
*1 Diplomacy
*1 Gather Info
*1 Sense Motive
*1 Listen?
*1 Spot?
*6 Other?

===Level 8: [[Dragoman]] 2===
*Stat Bonus: Charisma
*Class Feature: Skill Mastery (Sense Motive?)
*1 Diplomacy
*1 Gather Info
*1 Sense Motive
*1 Bluff?
*1 Intimidate?
*6 Other?

[[Category:PC Character Sheets]]